Which Should I Buy?

[tgb]

I'm jonesing for a deeper war game and am looking at both Combat Mission Red Thunder (I haven't played a CM game since the first engine) and Flashpoint Campaigns Red Storm. I'm also considering CM:Battles for Normandy but the website doesn't say anything about it running on Win 8.

Thoughts & recommendations?

[MengJiao]

I'm jonesing for a deeper war game and am looking at both Combat Mission Red Thunder (I haven't played a CM game since the first engine) and Flashpoint Campaigns Red Storm. I'm also considering CM:Battles for Normandy but the website doesn't say anything about it running on Win 8.

Thoughts & recommendations?

  I haven't played Red Storm at all and haven't played CM: Normandy in quite a while BUT I am currently playing CMRT and it is the most deeply satisfying war game I have ever played.  It is very atmospheric.  I'm in the midst of a modfied (by me) scenario where the Russians try to seize some river crossings on the run with mostly just tanks.  I tried it that way and found I needed more Red Hordes to really get all those crossings and the entrenched position guarding them.  So I added 3 SMG companies and a recon Company and some 120mm mortars for smoke.  The result so far as been a pretty wild battle, but the tanks may soon be breaking out and there will be even more excitement.

  On the other hand, if you start on CMRT, be prepared to do some work on learning the system.  It can be frustrating.

[Skoop]

If you haven't played combat mission in the cmx2 era, RT would be a good one to jump into, east front is always the best for me.  CMBM is great really enjoyed the MG module, the 3.0 features will be added by a paid patch eventually.

I haven't played flash point campaigns, I already have steel beasts to scratch the Cold War fulda gap itch.

[tgb]

  On the other hand, if you start on CMRT, be prepared to do some work on learning the system.  It can be frustrating.

Isn't it the same system as CMBO, but with a newer engine?  What's changed?

[Skoop]

There's a lot of stuff different, main one is it is a 1:1 3d world your working with, cmbo abstracted a lot of things.  You can play in rts or wego as well.

[Boggit]

  On the other hand, if you start on CMRT, be prepared to do some work on learning the system.  It can be frustrating.

Isn't it the same system as CMBO, but with a newer engine?  What's changed?

Have a look at some of my reviews. The difference between CMBO, and CMBN is massive. 8)

[Redwolf]

  On the other hand, if you start on CMRT, be prepared to do some work on learning the system.  It can be frustrating.

Isn't it the same system as CMBO, but with a newer engine?  What's changed?

Everything. For one thing they gave up on the 1:1 modeling.

Then there are the crazy "action spots" that make it really hard to position infantry realistically or move AVFs and guns to where they can actually shoot something.

Also a very aggressive form of DRM that anchors itself deep in the system, disabled itself when you plug in new hardware (such as a USB headset) and doesn't uninstall when you uninstall the game.

[MikeGER]

tgb, comparing Flashpoint Campaigns Red Storm against Combat Mission Red Thunder is like apples and oranges.
I have both and i highly recommend both!
If you can somehow squeeze off some bucks from other RL-sectores like food, gas, entertainments, get both ... they scratch total different spot in the world of wargaming-joy and both spots want to be scratched badly

CMRT has the latest 3.0  improvements of the actual CM engine and is quite immersive with is 1.1 representation and 'what you see is what you get' on the digital battlefield now (there is always room for improvements but the engine and tactical AI of the units had evolved alot! since CMSF....not to speak of your grandfathers CMBO) 
get the latest demo, for familiarizing when you come from CMBO  (3.0 improvements are not in that demo, its quite old, but at least you get the idea... I'm not sure if demo is even on 2.0 standarts)

http://www.battlefront.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2143&Itemid=318

FC:RS  is more a tactical (board)game (even so individual vehicles are modeled) with 500m hexes and its has a very high replay value just dealing with one single little scenario, again and again and again ... AI plays out different every time and every time its just stunning! and feels quite realistic too
(here also a wishlist exists ...but some wishes get already coded while i type and will show up in the 2.04 patch short behind the horizon)
also get the contest/demo, for a peek
(the scenario is hard cause it was a meant as contest and its also not the latest patch ...so some 'oddities' had already been addressed in the 2.03a patch.... the demo is V2.02 special promo edition)   
http://grogheads.com/downloads/FlashpointRedStorm-Setup-Promo.exe

[tgb]

Thanks, all.  I think I'm going with Flashpoint Campaigns for two reasons 1) the theater and setting is new to me, so the whole game will be a fresh experience and 2) Matrix>Battlefront.

[Nefaro]

It's a good wargame.  :)

[Zulu1966]

Thanks, all.  I think I'm going with Flashpoint Campaigns for two reasons 1) the theater and setting is new to me, so the whole game will be a fresh experience and 2) Matrix>Battlefront.

Well leaving the ridiculous post by redwolf aside, the only thing I would say about flashpoint is that whilst it's an excellent game I found it getting very samey after a while. I found most of what I played consisted of holding the line against massively overwhelming Soviet numbers. That's great but personally I just found it getting a bit meh after a while. The maps are relatively small so it largely consisted of setting up blocking positions and falling back. As I say I really liked the way they p u t this game together and will buy the next one without thinking that's just a personal opinion of how I felt after playing it a while.

The cm series are the best war games ever made in my view and one thing they give in spades is atmosphere and variety.

Not criticising your choice and you may find the content interesting for longer than I did it's just a view.

[tgb]

Now I'm having a hard time pulling the trigger on either because 1)my backlog and 2) I'm just not used to spending $50 or more on a game any longer.

I feel the way I do every time I try to play WitP - I install it, stare at the screen in bewilderment for a few minutes, and then move on to something else.

[Skoop]

I doubt you will stare at the screen in CMRT like WITP, there's 3d pixel troopen to blow up and watch some action go on.  You might loose horribly in the learning process but atleast you will get some great battle scenes out of it for entertainment value.

[Redwolf]

Thanks, all.  I think I'm going with Flashpoint Campaigns for two reasons 1) the theater and setting is new to me, so the whole game will be a fresh experience and 2) Matrix>Battlefront.

Well leaving the ridiculous post by redwolf aside, the only thing I would say about flashpoint is that whilst it's an excellent game I found it getting very samey after a while. I found most of what I played consisted of holding the line against massively overwhelming Soviet numbers. That's great but personally I just found it getting a bit meh after a while. The maps are relatively small so it largely consisted of setting up blocking positions and falling back. As I say I really liked the way they p u t this game together and will buy the next one without thinking that's just a personal opinion of how I felt after playing it a while.

The cm series are the best war games ever made in my view and one thing they give in spades is atmosphere and variety.

Not criticising your choice and you may find the content interesting for longer than I did it's just a view.

CMRT is a good game and worth the money, as discussed on the official forum.

That doesn't change the fact that the issues I mentioned are real, and deliberate choices on part of BFC, and areas where the game is worse than CMx1.

[Zulu1966]

Thanks, all.  I think I'm going with Flashpoint Campaigns for two reasons 1) the theater and setting is new to me, so the whole game will be a fresh experience and 2) Matrix>Battlefront.

Well leaving the ridiculous post by redwolf aside, the only thing I would say about flashpoint is that whilst it's an excellent game I found it getting very samey after a while. I found most of what I played consisted of holding the line against massively overwhelming Soviet numbers. That's great but personally I just found it getting a bit meh after a while. The maps are relatively small so it largely consisted of setting up blocking positions and falling back. As I say I really liked the way they p u t this game together and will buy the next one without thinking that's just a personal opinion of how I felt after playing it a while.

The cm series are the best war games ever made in my view and one thing they give in spades is atmosphere and variety.

Not criticising your choice and you may find the content interesting for longer than I did it's just a view.

CMRT is a good game and worth the money, as discussed on the official forum.

That doesn't change the fact that the issues I mentioned are real, and deliberate choices on part of BFC, and areas where the game is worse than CMx1.

Well action spots present issues - sometimes as any game has issues with they way it models anything - just not in the way you said they do nor to the extent you imply. Just the usual hyperbole people seem to have to apply when picking faults with this game for some reason.

I can think of no way CMx1 wins over CMx2 - not one. Otherwise I would be playing that instead of the other. Again - people who cite cmx1 as in some way superior always forget all the things that game didn't do.