Dark Souls II on PC

Nefaro · April 28, 2014, 02:21:29 PM

Don't get me wrong, I regularly enjoy difficult games and especially ones involving unknown effects you must discover.

The key word there being "enjoy".

If I want a fun exploration RPG that is difficult, I'll go play roguelikes.

Grimnirsson · April 28, 2014, 04:32:58 PM

QuoteThere is a nice in-between...like Skyrim.

I love Skyrim...it's a great movie...you can and want to watch it over and over again...it's just great and awesome. DS 1+2 (and I suppose Demon Souls which I never played) is not like watching a great movie...it's you being the actor in your movie...if you act good, you get a good movie, if you act great, you get a great movie...if you suck...you blame the game...you can not compare a Souls game with Skyrim...or any other RPG out there...unless you never played it or...the game was more than you could handle...these games are in NO WAY difficult or sadistic or whatever you might call it...it's just a game experience from another time...the games we know today turned us all into video game pussies...that's all. Enjoy that state or...GROW UP and beat the game :)

Gusington · April 28, 2014, 04:35:08 PM

^I'm probably older than you are. So don't make me take you over my knee and give you a spanking.

Grimnirsson · April 28, 2014, 04:38:00 PM

QuoteI'm probably older than you are

Are you sure...? ;)

Gusington · April 28, 2014, 04:45:33 PM

No. But if you want to get masochistically tortured by a game, that's your business. Some people are into that as proven by this thread. Some are not. But game pussification is another realm. Not liking Dark Souls is not pussification.

Nefaro · April 28, 2014, 04:57:47 PM

Quote from: Gusington on April 28, 2014, 04:35:08 PM
^I'm probably older than you are. So don't make me take you over my knee and give you a spanking.

He's a kinky one, that Gus.

Grimnirsson · April 28, 2014, 05:00:41 PM

Quoteif you want to get masochistically tortured by a game, that's your business.

I don't want that and DS2 is not torturing me...I'm enjoying it quite a lot and also think DS2 is much easier than DS1...which I'm also enjoying greatly.

QuoteNot liking Dark Souls is not pussification.

It is, because the Souls games are not what the opinion of those who consider them too hard make of them 'da hardest game in da world'...they are probably the most easiest games out there if you define easy as fair...if you can master the controls, if you can master your character...you can easily master the game.

W8taminute · April 28, 2014, 07:37:48 PM

I guess it all boils down to how much an individual is willing to invest in a game. By invest I mean time and effort not money. We each have our preferences and that's what makes us all interesting. Keep in mind though that games like DS do appeal to some and it is extremely rewarding for those who take a deep breath, take their time, and invest their time.

Here's another example I'd like to share. When Civ III first came out I bought the collector's edition in the tin metal box on day one. I put more time into that game in my personal gaming history then all the other games I've ever played combined. And for the first 5 years I sucked ass so badly I'd frequently rage quit and threaten to give up video games for good. I just couldn't figure out how to beat the game on the harder difficulties and it tasked me. It really tasked me. I had to beat this game and I was obsessed. To this day I can count on 3 fingers how many times I've beaten the game on King level. I felt like such a whimp compared to the Civ gods that constantly boasted how easy the game was on the forums over at Civfanatics. When Civ IV and V came out those games were so much more easier for me for some reason. I guess what I'm trying to say is that you have to really want to play a game and be willing to go through the pain. Something about Civ III hooked me in and I couldn't stop playing the game I loved to hate. It was like a crazy girlfriend or something. Dark Souls is like that for me only I'm much better at Dark Souls than I ever was at Civ.

Keep calm and grog on boys... ;D

Toonces · April 28, 2014, 08:17:40 PM

What I found is that Dark Souls is a neat game for what it is. By that, I mean comparing it to something like Skyrim misses the whole point. DS stands on its own as a game.

I really like the idea of Dark Souls. Where it fails, for me, is the "expect to die over and over" part. Again, I understand that this is an intentional design issue, and if figuring out the pattern and then beating it is your thing then I totally see how this can be enjoyable.

For me, though, I just couldn't find the fun in Dark Souls. And that's very frustrating because I know it's an excellent game. I simply cannot find it fun.

Gusington · April 28, 2014, 08:38:53 PM

I also understand that dying all the time is intentional. I just don't like it either.

W8taminute · April 28, 2014, 11:17:10 PM

Yeah you nailed it Toonces. Dying over and over again until you finally succeed is indeed frustrating. I admit that. To ask someone to like a game where dying is going to be a frequent occurrence is asking a lot.

There are some levels in the game where I walk around killing everything in sight without breaking a sweat and there are other areas where I've died so many times I scream in rage at the tv only to dive back in again. It's kind of calming in a strange way though.

Dying over and over again at the hands of some camping sniper though is something that is totally very unfun for me. I ask myself why I continue to play shooters then and the only answer I can come up with is it's fun to sneak around on the battlefield looking for kills.

Nefaro · April 28, 2014, 11:30:35 PM

Quote from: W8taminute on April 28, 2014, 11:17:10 PM
Yeah you nailed it Toonces. Dying over and over again until you finally succeed is indeed frustrating. I admit that. To ask someone to like a game where dying is going to be a frequent occurrence is asking a lot.

I actually enjoy numerous games where you're expected to die at some point without making it to the end. Roguelikes are a fine example. The WOFF campaigns are also like that. But each time you die, you start off again in a new form, with different capabilities or strengths, and the next journey is dynamic and unpredictable every time.

Having to repeatedly restart in the same situation is more like Groundhog Day torture. It also smells of puzzle solving. I don't mind guaranteed death and failure.. if the next try is different every time.

Gusington · April 29, 2014, 08:01:17 AM

That is a good point too and better explained than I did above.

Grimnirsson · April 29, 2014, 11:15:17 AM

Especially in DS2 which as I said is easier than DS1 I rarely die because I have tons of healing items and spells. You are not expected to die here or there because the designer thought that a funny point for you to die or numerous times, dying is not the real intention of this game. If I die, I do because I lost concentration, sucked with the controls, rushed in an unknown area etc.. If you play this game like you actually are your character i.e. cautiously, then there is no need to die constantly. The intention of the game is to punish you for a sloppy play style and biting off more than you can chew and it rewards you for a game session where you actually think about your situation and care about your characters life. And exactly this makes it a rare game among all the others out there...

Gusington · April 29, 2014, 01:26:17 PM

I don't have this hobby to get punished.