IT COOMMMMMEEESSS!!
...it commmesss...
QuoteGreetings Backers!
Playdek here with an update for the digital development of Twilight Struggle. Currently we are working with Steam to get Twilight Struggle onto their platform, however we have run into an unexpected issue that has prevented us from being able to upload the game. We are just waiting for this last piece to fall into place so we can send the game out, however we do not know how long this will actually take so we apologize. We will continue to keep you up to date with information regarding the beta release as they develop. In the meantime, this has given us additional time to develop the game so that more features will be included when we are able to release beta.
Soon.
Soon.
I've never played the boardgame, but I am a big fan of the CDG concept. I love the game's theme, and I cannot wait. First day purchase, and I will *definitely* play this one multiplayer once I've got a few games under my belt.
yup, having taken part in the game we had here i loved it, cant wait for a PC version but i dont see 'soon' mentioned anywhere above JP :-[
I think I'm the only person in North America who didn't love the boardgame.
I don't love it either. I like it, but it's not in my go-to selection of games I'd like to play most. I think the components are great and I love the historical detail on the cards but I'm not a huge fan of the gameplay mechanic. I've played a dozen times or so and I find that it tends to bog down into the same strategies nearly every time and there's too much riding on whether or not you you pull the right card into your deck when you need it. I'll still end up getting the app.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on September 24, 2015, 12:07:26 PM
I don't love it either. I like it, but it's not in my go-to selection of games I'd like to play most. I think the components are great and I love the historical detail on the cards but I'm not a huge fan of the gameplay mechanic. I've played a dozen times or so and I find that it tends to bog down into the same strategies nearly every time and there's too much riding on whether or not you you pull the right card into your deck when you need it.
That's how I felt about it too. I know plenty of guys who are kinda obsessed with it, so I figured I must not be getting something about the game.
Quote from: undercovergeek on September 24, 2015, 11:56:06 AM
cant wait for a PC version but i dont see 'soon' mentioned anywhere above JP :-[
According to the email (sent to Kickstarter backers like myself), the only reason the digital edition isn't on Steam already is because of an issue that cropped up while putting it on the Steam servers. Once they fix the problem, it'll at least be running open Beta. Though it may only be open for Kickstarters. Still the plan is to have it running this autumn.
[Edited to add: only closed beta for some kickstarters currently. The original email was a bit vague about that.]
Nice...this game is pretty good. 1989 is a good one, too.
So this will have a single player vs. AI version? I thought the intention was multiplayer only.
Quote from: Toonces on September 24, 2015, 05:36:46 PM
So this will have a single player vs. AI version? I thought the intention was multiplayer only.
Supposed to, last I read.
Any game that resembles Balance of Power is a must for me.
I'll be interested to see how it does as a solo game. As with any other boardgame, I think much of the appeal is the player interaction while sitting at the table and I think that by not having that is the big reason why boardgame to PC game ports fail. I don't want to be negative though so holding high hopes that it's a worthwhile design.
I'm expecting to do some multi-player with it.
Why not just stick with VASSAL or the Tabletop Simulator versions if you're going the multiplayer route? The tabletop sim version is realky well done.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=420342971&searchtext= (http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=420342971&searchtext=)
Gots me, the VASSAL module works great multiplayer, it even automates a bunch of the activities for you and it's free. Plus you can put a lot of smack-talk in you chat log. It's *that* back and forth that makes TT games enjoyable and as I mentioned, you just lose that with PC games unless you headset up.
Quote from: GJK on September 25, 2015, 05:17:20 AM
Gots me, the VASSAL module works great multiplayer, it even automates a bunch of the activities for you and it's free. Plus you can put a lot of smack-talk in you chat log. It's *that* back and forth that makes TT games enjoyable and as I mentioned, you just lose that with PC games unless you headset up.
I could be wrong, but the new computer version will probably not require the player to actually own a copy of the board game. While VASSAL does in theory. Of course I'm sure some naughty folks play the VASSAL module without owning a copy...but that is another matter. And if the new version has a decent AI...well that's a plus.
But I agree, the game does not do much for me solitaire, but face to face...its great.
Steam issues were resolved; closed beta keys are being emailed out over the next few days.
I honestly don't recall now what the hell package I bought... :'( I think it was (only) the PC digital, but...
I received, and registered, my Steam beta key.
I fired it up and submitted my new player account registration info. My account creation has been "pending" for about 10 minutes, now. I hope it isn't frozen up and I'm just in a queue of new players. ???
I don't see this on Steam. ???
Got my key as well....looks like only multi player right now, was hoping to play single player...
BBMIKE, did you buy during kickstarter? If so, then you would be sent the beta key via email.
Quote from: Ubercat on October 02, 2015, 06:18:05 PM
I received, and registered, my Steam beta key.
I fired it up and submitted my new player account registration info. My account creation has been "pending" for about 10 minutes, now. I hope it isn't frozen up and I'm just in a queue of new players. ???
That screen never seems to go away...however, in the background you'll receive an email where you have to verify your account. Once you do that, just cancel out of the pending screen and then login with your account. That worked for me.
Ah, no on the Kickstarter. I thought this had been released on Steam.
Damn Gmail with its splitting up Emails into categories! No wonder I couldn't see the confirmation Email!
Well, I'm playing now.
Quote from: Ubercat on October 02, 2015, 07:30:13 PM
Damn Gmail with its splitting up Emails into categories! No wonder I couldn't see the confirmation Email!
Well, I'm playing now.
We got about halfway through turn 1 and my opponent stopped doing anything. After more than a half hour I was informed by the game that he'd conceded. I don't know whether to wish that it was just a bug that he couldn't get past or that he was a thoughtless A-hole!
Interestingly, I couldn't find any functionality to communicate in game. I couldn't even say hi.
No single player?
Quote from: JasonPratt on October 02, 2015, 12:46:35 PM
Steam issues were resolved; closed beta keys are being emailed out over the next few days.
Quote from: bbmike on October 02, 2015, 06:35:20 PM
Ah, no on the Kickstarter. I thought this had been released on Steam.
Yes, and no. Yes, activated now on Steam, after some trouble getting the game properly uploaded and set up on Steam servers. No, the activation is only for a closed beta right now.
The original email had been unclear about what exactly was activating on Steam. The email alert I got... yesterday? Thursday? ...and posted, was clear that the activation was closed beta -- which I clarified at the time.
It now occurs to me I should have fixed the thread title once matters became clearer. Very sorry, will promptly do so now. :-[
I"m in and up as Cyrano, but am not of a mind to play against those I don't know.
Anyone here about up for a game, just let me know?
Best,
Jim
"Cyrano"
:/7)
I'm Ubercat on the server.
I'm not sure what all the variable game settings do. Forex, is the timing one a deadline for each player to submit their latest turn? It appears that you can invite a specific player to a game. In that case, go ahead and invite me. I'm about to go to work or I'd start one myself. I'd suggest the time to be 3 days to be safe. I'll look tonight when I get home, and should be good for several turns a day at least.
OK, they're in BETA, I get that, but, apparently, you can't set up a game and leave it setup for someone to choose it later even if it's a friend invitation?
That's something that needs fixing.
Also, once I cancelled my first attempt to create a game with Ubercat, it would no longer let me drag Ubercat to the invite box...
As I say, they're in BETA...
Looks like it worked after all. I've joined both of the games that you started. You're the Russians in both cases so it's your go to place your IP's.
Yep...let's do this :)...
TANKS WILL ROLL INTO THE WEST...really...
Quote from: Cyrano on October 04, 2015, 09:20:57 AM
Yep...let's do this :)...
TANKS WILL ROLL INTO THE WEST...really...
You should keep this one handy:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi116.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fo4%2Fskylark_on_siege%2Fi_must_break_you.jpg&hash=9c4503cba1e96d34b03b5a9c15d968eeef3babc0)
My hairdo alone should prove sufficient!!
Finally....Single Player mode released just a little while ago for beta...I have A LOT of learning to do since I went through tutorial and very little made sense to me:)
Given that they've evolved "A.I.s" for the other COIN card-based games, I guess it's not too surprising, but the A.I. in this one is pretty damned sharp.
There's a reason this was, until quite recently, the best game on BGG. It may not be the greatest game of all time, but it's among them.
Cat, time to fire it up again, I think...
They released a long email about how they implemented the AI so hopefully turns out to be a decent opponent.....
Somehow need to learn the rules of the game, the tutorial just did not click with me....maybe I'll get lucky and find the electronic rules of the board game somewhere on the web. The map and playing surface really do look polished and nice so hopefully the actual gameplay is equally good.
Board game rules
http://www.gmtgames.com/nnts/TS_Rules-2015.pdf
Quote from: Barthheart on March 13, 2016, 07:29:44 AM
Board game rules
http://www.gmtgames.com/nnts/TS_Rules-2015.pdf
Excellent...thanks!
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on March 12, 2016, 08:56:35 PM
Finally....Single Player mode released just a little while ago for beta...I have A LOT of learning to do since I went through tutorial and very little made sense to me:)
Excellent! This is what I've been waiting for. Now I can get comfortable with the UI before I'm pulverized by other human players. :knuppel2:
Im having trouble finding info about this game. Wheres its steam page or kickstarter.
I believe -- someone check me if I'm wrong -- that the BETA is only available to KS backers.
Given the condition, though, it shouldn't be long for release.
Now regretting not getting both the PC and iPad versions.
Correct...only available for backers at the moment.
I am still embarrassed to say that I am having a hard time understaning the rules, even after reading the rule book and playing the tutorial...not sure why not clicking.
But I will not give up since seems like a fun game underneath:)
I must say that the AI is doing a fairly consistent job of winning so far. I'm not a master level player by any stretch but I do know how to play and I've only won 1 in 4 games at this point. In the most recent game I made the mistake of playing a card that let the AI use 1 OP point during my turn when DefCon was level 2. It couped a country and made me auto lose for triggering nuclear war!
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on March 14, 2016, 05:05:17 AM
Correct...only available for backers at the moment.
I am still embarrassed to say that I am having a hard time understaning the rules, even after reading the rule book and playing the tutorial...not sure why not clicking.
But I will not give up since seems like a fun game underneath:)
I'm up for a game via VASSAL or TableTop Sim if you want to go through a learning game or three.
Thanks SD...might take you up on the offer at some point...want to try and re-read the manual and play the tutorials first just to try and make it sink in.
Supposed to be released tomorrow! April 13. O0
From Playdek:
QuoteOur focus for the game after this release will be our continued effort to implement AI. By releasing the game to a larger player-base soon, we will be able to generate more game data to use for AI training.
Ugg, all these new games! I'm going to have to set up an offshore account to protect myself from my wife!
Interesting...didn't seem like it was in beta that long, but I guess good to get it exposed to a bigger audience....I still have to figure this one out myself:)
Quote from: bbmike on April 12, 2016, 07:38:06 AM
Ugg, all these new games! I'm going to have to set up an offshore account to protect myself from my wife!
It's not the money that leaves me scratching my head after reading posts regarding new game purchases, it's the time needed to learn and play the games....!!!??? Some guys on these forums must live in an alternate universe with 48 hour days.
I haven't bought a computer game this year... I can't say the same about boardgames, though ;-) But this is one I'm getting first thing. I've wanted to play this for years, but knew I couldn't get any of my friends to play with me. Now I can learn it and play online, once I can beat the computer, that is.
Not sure if true, but saw a post suggest retail price of 14.99 and during launch 11.99.... Again, not sure if true but if so, that is a decent price for those that didn't back during kick starter.
The AI is tough, at least for me.
The only weakness I spotted, which may have been improved by now, is that it was relatively easy to get control of Europe as Russia. That's an instant win if you have control when Europe gets scored. You need to get the Blockade card, and hold it until you're fairly certain that the US AI has played all it's 3+ Ops cards. Of course you have no guarantee that you'll be the one to get it.
Still no install option unlocked. WHY DO YOU TAUNT ME SO!? :tickedoff:
{watching clock for noon}
$12 for the first week?
https://www.facebook.com/Playdek
Might have to grab it for that.
so does this in anyway feel like a cold war simulator, or is it all just a boardgame?
^ Yes.
>:D
Now for the all-important question of: who shall be doing the multiplayer AAR for Grogheads?
For this purpose we should have an absolute newbie. For science. 8)
Quote from: Rayfer on April 12, 2016, 05:25:44 PM
It's not the money that leaves me scratching my head after reading posts regarding new game purchases, it's the time needed to learn and play the games....!!!??? Some guys on these forums must live in an alternate universe with 48 hour days.
Think I enjoy learning new games, and their little intricacies, more than playing them all the way through. In fact, I know it to be so. Has always been that way for me, even with much of the tabletop stuff.
Once it seems like I know all there is to know about how such a thing works, and get pretty knowledgeable, then it starts losing it's lustrous mystery and moves into the realm of repetition. Almost always before reaching the end of the content, although a few games, or types of games, keep me returning.
Most would think me crazy for mentioning my enjoyment for learning new games' mechanics, reading manuals and tooltips like an addiction. Maybe it
is nutty as squirrel turds.
When you're playing a human being as opposed to the AI, do you have to sit there and wait while he takes his turn, or can you leave and come back when he's done as in PBEM ?
Dumb question time:
Way back when, I Kickstarted/pledged for a PC version of Twilight Struggle. I rather assumed it would be something I could download and play on my computer...but only now realized I was likely wrong.
So is this how it will work? I have to go thru Steam to use the game? And does that mean I can't play off-line? (I have never used Steam nor do I have an account and no Nothing about it).
You have to be online to run the game the first time. After that, you can put Steam in offline mode and still play single player. I don't know if multi-player will work if Steam's offline.
Quote from: avrotim on April 13, 2016, 02:30:34 PM
Dumb question time:
Way back when, I Kickstarted/pledged for a PC version of Twilight Struggle. I rather assumed it would be something I could download and play on my computer...but only now realized I was likely wrong.
So is this how it will work? I have to go thru Steam to use the game? And does that mean I can't play off-line? (I have never used Steam nor do I have an account and no Nothing about it).
I Kickstarted for a PC version and got to install it months ago. Did you miss an Email? It does require Steam.
Not all Kickstarter backers got to participate in the open beta, apparently; I never got an email with a code to activate on Steam, either, until yesterday -- and even when I activated it, the Steam page didn't exist and I had no option from the game list to install it!
Avrotim, a Steam account is free (but addictive like crack cocaine, so beware be very aware). It will install a small application on your system which, depending on how you set it up, will check for updates to itself and for games you bought on Steam (or bought elsewhere like from Matrix and also activated on Steam), whenever you boot your computer. There have been security issues, but it's kind of de rigeur (or however the French spell it) to operate now. Odds are very good if you buy a boxed game, or a game off Gamersgate, all you're really doing is buying a Steam code. (Although GG still has some non-Steam games, they converted everything possible to a Steam code in the past few years.)
Personally I recommend setting up a Paypal account if you don't have one yet, and telling Steam to use that (but not automatically, so that it shifts you to PP and requires to to enter a password you don't have saved as a cookie or on Steam), if you're worried about security issues.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on April 13, 2016, 11:15:26 AM
so does this in anyway feel like a cold war simulator, or is it all just a boardgame?
I might be in the minority, but with my limited time in the beta, didn't really feel like a cold war simulator to me, it felt more like a boardgame. It seems like it will still be a decent game to play, but doesn't replace my desire for a full blow global simulator....
Great tutorial! I like the visual style but it does kind of remind me of Political Machine 2016. It is certainly a board game but I like that. I hope we see more of these. O0
No review yet but maybe once I play a full game.
So far I'm digging it. I would be up for some MP once I get some play throughs. I think they did an excellent job with it thus far.
PE
Just a Groghead's service announcement, keep an eye on your frame rates and GPU temperature when playing the game. My FPS numbers were 200+ and my GPU was 77C. The temperature and load was on par with the graphics intensive X-Com 2. This appears to be a known issue, but there is no word on a fix to rein in the frames.
The more you know... O0
So our GPUs might get thermonuclear hot? >:D
You usually see people complaining about low frame rates. This is a switch. Can it really overheat your computer and burn out your monitor, or is that just troll-talk?
Quote from: Philippe on April 14, 2016, 08:37:20 AM
You usually see people complaining about low frame rates. This is a switch. Can it really overheat your computer and burn out your monitor, or is that just troll-talk?
This is the second place I've seen it mentioned.
Wouldn't be the first game that has attempted to max out the CPU/GPU usage the whole time. Even if your computer's cooling can keep up with everything running at it's hellbent maximum for long periods, causing very high temperatures, it can still shorten lifespans and slowly bake off the thermal transfer paste. Aside from possible overheats and freezes if it does lose the cooling fight.
Most games with this problem eventually get fixed with some kind of throttling being implemented.
I played on a MAC and did not notice any CPU or GPU spike while playing.
PE
I think I may hold off on getting this one until the problem is fixed.
Hi,
Using Nvidia Inspector on my MSI GTX 980ti, running at 2560x1440 .. I locked the FPS at 60, .. and set Power Management Mode to Adaptive.
My GPU Usage= ~32%
GPU downclocks itself to 135 MHz
GPU Temp= ~58 degrees (idle temp is ~50)
Fan Speed= 0 rpm
Everything running nice and cool .. :)
It's an incredibly well done adaptation of the Boardgame, .. which I've had for a few years, .. but never played .. :'(
.. now at last .. I can play TS .. :)
EDIT: I've posted my Nvidia Settings, .. for those that might want to try them.
Cheers
Tom
I bought and played the tutorial for 40 mins before I read this, then refunded it. I'll hold off until it's fixed. I don't want to start going under the hood of my OS to fix this. 200 FPS is pretty excessive so this needs to be fixed. I did really enjoy the game.
Quote from: Capn Darwin on April 14, 2016, 08:18:39 AMmy GPU was 77C.
That's disturbing. I get an alert when I'm pushing 65 (which should never in fact happen) and at 67 I can smell electric things and plastic get very hot. I had a pc ignite once. It's not something I would want to see anyone go through. It was from a failed power unit fan, but nevertheless...
Quote from: Ian C on April 14, 2016, 10:35:46 AM
I had a pc ignite once.
Man, that is so kick ass! :o
Hi,
Twilight Struggle 1.0.3.1 is out, .. which looks like it's resolved the Frame Rate issues. :)
.. working fine for me .. :)
Cheers
Tom
Quote from: Toonces on April 14, 2016, 12:26:38 PM
Quote from: Ian C on April 14, 2016, 10:35:46 AM
I had a pc ignite once.
Man, that is so kick ass! :o
No it isn't. Each time I smell smoke of any kind in the house now, I get paranoid. I was about to go the store just before it caught light and only took a pee at the last moment before I left. If I hadn't, chances are there would have been major property damage, or no home to come back to.
Good to hear the update has resolved the issue.
Glad to hear there are at least some benefits to weak a bladder.
I lost a computer to a short back in the nineties. It was in the days of multiple sound cards, and my power source couldn't handle all the extra hardware. I was bombing Panama when I got caught by a SAM. My plane went down in flames and my computer started emitting smoke, motherboard totally fried. Electrical issues in a computer are no laughing matter (though I was impressed with how realistic that flight sim was). I would have known better if I'd taken shop in high school, but that was never really an option because I was supposed to be in college prep.
Played the tutorial, and my computer didn't melt down ha ha... ^-^
This game drips atmosphere, and its user interface is aces (so far). It isn't a simulation like, say, a late game of Hearts of Iron 2, Jarhead, but it's kind of a political sim translated to board game rules. If when we do a multiplayer AAR, you'll be able to get a better idea; although actually a team of Grogs was playing a Vassal version of the game in one of our forum categories a year or two ago.
I need to check this out soon™.
I need more videos or lets plays.I am quite lost.
Quote from: kmbgolf on April 15, 2016, 03:04:58 PM
I need more videos or lets plays.I am quite lost.
I am very close to buying this..but I just downloaded a pdf file of the rules. Thirty pages of densely packed writing. This is a very complex game, under the hood.
I think in the long run it will be worth it, especially for the price....I haven't mastered the rules either, but hopefully some day.
Quote from: DennisS on April 15, 2016, 07:22:46 PM
Quote from: kmbgolf on April 15, 2016, 03:04:58 PM
I need more videos or lets plays.I am quite lost.
I am very close to buying this..but I just downloaded a pdf file of the rules. Thirty pages of densely packed writing. This is a very complex game, under the hood.
Most of the rule book is taken up with an example of play and descriptions of the events depicted on the cards. The actual rules are fairly simple. Just remember that in the early war turns, the only scoring cards in the deck are Europe, Asia, and the Middle East. Try to concentrate on getting and holding influence there. If you're the USSR, make sure you attempt a coup in a battleground country in Western Europe right off the bat. Italy's usually a tempting target due to its low stability. Attempting a coup will knock the defcon track down and prevent the US from staging their own coup in Europe. Also, you should definitely try for Iran, Iraq as controlling that corner of the ME gives you a path into Asia via India, Pakistan, Afghanistan.
Hopefully the forthcoming multiplayer game (which I at least plan to AAR) between Bartheart and I, will clarify the complexity or lack of it. We're both absolute newbies at the game.
Early War favours the USSR so if you play as the Commies you'll want to push hard for the early win.,,coup hard and try to secure scoring opportunities in the 3 scoring zones. Red Scare/Red Purge is a very powerful card. That's the one you'll want to play as your headline card if you get it no matter which side you're playing as. Blockade is a good card to play as an event. Most others are better used for the ops points instead of events.
As the US, the early war phase is more about preventing the Soviets from racking up points than it is about getting them yourself. Use ops points to act as spoilers and reduce Soviet influence in non-battleground countries to prevent them from being able to achieve dominance rank when scoring cards are played.
Remember that once a scoring card has been played, it's going to be out of circulation until the deck is exhausted and gets reshuffled. This means you can ignore the region that was just scored for a while and concentrate on the other two.
If you do get a really bad card in your hand that would greatly benefit the other guy if you played it, remember that you can use it to do the Space Race once per turn which allows you to play the card without triggering the event. You can also play it combined with UN Intervention to block the event. You can also hold onto it at the end of the turn to keep the other guy from getting it (unless you were forced to discard or used UN intervention earlier which means you won't have enough cards left to keep one in reserve.)
May be of some help but the Forum Based game that we started a few years ago gives a breakdown of the turns and how the game runs. Pertinent dialog starts here:
http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=8393.msg209723#msg209723
thank you
Red Scare/Purge and 1 or 2 other cards seem bugged in that I can never headline them.
If you, as the Soviets, play Blockade too early in he turn, you're likely to just give the AI an opportunity to dump one of YOUR cards that you otherwise might have wanted the event to go off when they had to play it.
I wrote up an intro/AAR piece to Brant for hopeful inclusion on the Front Page. I can attest to the fact that the game very much favors the Communists early on.
But I also suck at this game, too. :(
Quote from: Ubercat on April 16, 2016, 02:55:34 PM
Red Scare/Purge and 1 or 2 other cards seem bugged in that I can never headline them.
Are you playing with the China Civil War option on? Because that deactivates certain China-related cards as events (they can still be played for influence points or other things like that) until the Soviet player invests 3 influence into China.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on April 16, 2016, 03:48:46 PM
I wrote up an intro/AAR piece to Brant for hopeful inclusion on the Front Page. I can attest to the fact that the game very much favors the Communists early on.
But I also suck at this game, too. :(
Yup, early war favours the USSR, mid war is neutral, late war favours the USA.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on April 15, 2016, 08:37:58 PM
Quote from: DennisS on April 15, 2016, 07:22:46 PM
Quote from: kmbgolf on April 15, 2016, 03:04:58 PM
I need more videos or lets plays.I am quite lost.
I am very close to buying this..but I just downloaded a pdf file of the rules. Thirty pages of densely packed writing. This is a very complex game, under the hood.
Most of the rule book is taken up with an example of play and descriptions of the events depicted on the cards. The actual rules are fairly simple. Just remember that in the early war turns, the only scoring cards in the deck are Europe, Asia, and the Middle East. Try to concentrate on getting and holding influence there. If you're the USSR, make sure you attempt a coup in a battleground country in Western Europe right off the bat. Italy's usually a tempting target due to its low stability. Attempting a coup will knock the defcon track down and prevent the US from staging their own coup in Europe. Also, you should definitely try for Iran, Iraq as controlling that corner of the ME gives you a path into Asia via India, Pakistan, Afghanistan.
This advice is precisely what the 428-page pdf file on TS strategy advocates.
Having lived through a very significant part of the events of the cold war, this game is intensely interesting to me. I lived on or near NATO bases for ... 15 years, between 1960, and 1980, and the Cold War was always part of my life.
My introduction to the coming mp game with Bartheart (or with someone else, according to circumstances), has now been occurred! (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=16763.msg441095#msg441095)
I'm 0-11 to start out with LOL
...I nominate Bboyer as a possible substitute for Barth if he can't make it. >:D
I think B_C's entry went live this afternoon (or Michael Enkenfels' did anyway O:-) ): http://grogheads.com/?p=10815
Still interested in this game. Any overheating since the update?
Had a crash issue last night when the game just completely froze, but no heat problems thus far.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 17, 2016, 04:37:25 PM
I think B_C's entry went live this afternoon (or Michael Enkenfels' did anyway O:-) ): http://grogheads.com/?p=10815
Good stuff. Makes me wish I were back home so I could pick this up. 10 more days. Couple questions arose after reading the AAR. In the board game, the US must use its 7 set up points in Western Europe only. Did they change that for the PC game? The player is initially limited to using one card per turn for the Space Race. Does the PC version let you throw more?
As far as I have played, the Space Race is limited to one card per turn dumped into it (although of course there are a few events, too.)
The initial influence placement rules in the PC version are definitely 7 for US, 6 for USSR, in Western and Eastern Europe respectively, with Austria and Finland counting in both categories, and with Turkey and Canada counted as Western Europe for purposes of the game.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on April 17, 2016, 05:35:31 PM
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 17, 2016, 04:37:25 PM
I think B_C's entry went live this afternoon (or Michael Enkenfels' did anyway O:-) ): http://grogheads.com/?p=10815
Good stuff. Makes me wish I were back home so I could pick this up. 10 more days. Couple questions arose after reading the AAR. In the board game, the US must use its 7 set up points in Western Europe only. Did they change that for the PC game? The player is initially limited to using one card per turn for the Space Race. Does the PC version let you throw more?
It's just like the board game. The US AI, incidentally, always puts 4 in W Germany and the other 3 in Italy. That's exactly what I've always done, as I've long considered it the optimal placement.
You can only space 1 card per turn until you reach the space that lets you space 2, as long as you're the first one to reach it. Once the other player reaches that spot, you're back to only 1 per turn, just like the board game.
Some day I'll get around to learning the other game that uses the system - Labyrinth.
Had it for a few years w/o ever playing. And now there's an expansion coming soon. :-\
There's at least one more game (other than Labyrinth) using a modified version of this system, although I don't recall offhand what it is... {checking} Oh right, Dawn of Freedom, which is essentially the final year (1989) of this game.
We the People and Hannibal: Rome vs Carthage use a similar prior system, which TS was inspired by. For the People and Path to Glory are, I think, Civil War and WW1 versions of WTP and so use a similar system.
Here I Stand (early Reformation Europe) and its direct sequel The Virgin Queen (Elizabethan Europe, duh), have been described as having somewhat similar mechanics to TS.
There are some connections to the COIN series (card assisted counterinsurgency games), although obviously those will be much more tactical: Fire In The Lake (Vietnam); Andean Abyss; Cuba Libre; and A Distant Plain (Afghanistan) -- those were developed by the same guy who adapted the TS system into Labyrinth.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 17, 2016, 09:42:33 PMThere are some connections to the COIN series (card assisted counterinsurgency games), although obviously those will be much more tactical: Fire In The Lake (Vietnam); Andean Abyss; Cuba Libre; and A Distant Plain (Afghanistan) -- those were developed by the same guy who adapted the TS system into Labyrinth.
TS wasn't adapted into Labyrinth. Volko's played TS, but other than cards and a box-and-point map, there's not a lot of similarities.
Also, the COIN games are perhaps "more tactical" than TS, but still completely
not tactical at all. There's no specific engagements and no specific outcomes of those engagements anywhere. There's no specific units, only 'forces' and 'bases'. There are broad actions, but no dedicated operational plans, even.
AA was a pure Volko creation. Every one after that he either co-designed (FITL, ADP), or handed the reins over completely to someone else (LoD).
The only similarity between TS and CD war games like WtP and Hannibal:RvC is that you can play the cards for Ops or the event. What the Ops are actually used for is vastly different between TS and the other games JP named.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 17, 2016, 09:42:33 PM
There's at least one more game (other than Labyrinth) using a modified version of this system, although I don't recall offhand what it is... {checking} Oh right, Dawn of Freedom, which is essentially the final year (1989) of this game.
We the People and Hannibal: Rome vs Carthage use a similar prior system, which TS was inspired by. For the People and Path to Glory are, I think, Civil War and WW1 versions of WTP and so use a similar system.
Here I Stand (early Reformation Europe) and its direct sequel The Virgin Queen (Elizabethan Europe, duh), have been described as having somewhat similar mechanics to TS.
There are some connections to the COIN series (card assisted counterinsurgency games), although obviously those will be much more tactical: Fire In The Lake (Vietnam); Andean Abyss; Cuba Libre; and A Distant Plain (Afghanistan) -- those were developed by the same guy who adapted the TS system into Labyrinth.
I think the
Hannibal: Rome vs Carthage is very different from these, although some of it may have inspired this stuff.
I'm not familiar with
Hannibal's specifics but I did own it's sequel, Successors: The battles for Alexander's Empire (http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/26457/successors-third-edition) many years ago (second edition?). Wish they'd do another re-release of that one, with all the errata done.
Would say the COIN stuff is the closest, but still different.
The Successors is one of my all-time favorite boardgames.
My only complaint with it is that the vanilla game forces you to play alternate history by keeping alive an obscure historical figure who should have died on the first turn.
Nothing that a few house rules can't fix (and I've always played using them).
I've always been more interested in the period covered by the middle and the end of the game, the attempt by Antigonus and his son Demetrius to claim Alexander's empire, and the struggle with the coalition that culminated in the battle of Issus.
To get that to play out in an historical fashion you would also need house rules to make Perdiccas very likely to attack anyone who steals Alexander's body, but to almost guarantee a mutiny if any of Perdiccas' troops get killed in the process (historically Perdiccas was murdered during a mutiny triggered by an unsuccesful attempt to force a crossing of the Nile after Ptolemy hijacked Alexander's funeral cortege). This would lead you into the settlement of Triparadeisos (a bit like a Hellenistic treaty of Versailles), which was the start of the second phase of the wars of the successors.
What you do is make Perdiccas suffer a huge loss of legitimacy if he doesn't punish the body theif. The situation is interesting because Perdiccas gets to be enormously powerful (Eumenes is one of his generals) but his army is extremely brittle because it freaks out if it takes any losses.
Eumenes of Cardia is my favorite successor. He couldn't succeed to the throne because he wasn't Macedonian, and nobody trusted him because he was too Greek and too smart.
Quote from: Philippe on April 18, 2016, 01:52:40 PM
The Successors is one of my all-time favorite boardgames.
My only complaint with it is that the vanilla game forces you to play alternate history by keeping alive an obscure historical figure who should have died on the first turn.
Nothing that a few house rules can't fix (and I've always played using them).
I've always been more interested in the period covered by the middle and the end of the game, the attempt by Antigonus and his son Demetrius to claim Alexander's empire, and the struggle with the coalition that culminated in the battle of Issus.
To get that to play out in an historical fashion you would also need house rules to make Perdiccas very likely to attack anyone who steals Alexander's body, but to almost guarantee a mutiny if any of Perdiccas' troops get killed in the process (historically Perdiccas was murdered during a mutiny triggered by an unsuccesful attempt to force a crossing of the Nile after Ptolemy hijacked Alexander's funeral cortege). This would lead you into the settlement of Triparadeisos (a bit like a Hellenistic treaty of Versailles), which was the start of the second phase of the wars of the successors.
I read
Ghost on the Throne last year, and it left me hungry for yet more of the Diadochoi craziness. Because it seemed to end abruptly, with some of the latter stories of the initial "phase" just getting shorter and more vague. Like the writer or publisher had a deadline or had already passed the bits he wanted to cover.
It also made me realize how much I missed that
Successors game. I recall it being quite pretty for the time (the 90s?). The 3rd edition probably looked even better (and had less errata I hope). I'm also more knowledgeable about the period than back then, so making sense of what the system was trying to model should be easier.
After looking for a used copy of the 3rd Edition last year, and seeing the going price, I decided against it. :o
...
Back on topic, I've been waffling about picking up
Twilight Struggle right now. I'll surely get it sometime, but knowing that the AI still has work left to be done makes me want to wait. Especially since I have so many games that I'm torn on which to play right now.
I owned the Avalon Hill first edition (lost in a move) and I picked up the third edition a couple of years ago. I'm pretty sure it wasn't direct from GMT, and I probably found it on Amazon rather than through Ebay.
Prices on Amazon can fluctuate wildly for this kind of thing. In the meantime there's always Vassal, though you'll lose the tactile quality of a high production value boardgame.
And Successors really shouldn't be played solitaire.
Bought. Running great. Like it.
Does anyone know which of the board game rules are the best to download? (assuming the PC game is anything like the board game) 2nd Ed or Deluxe? Thanks.
Get the 2015 edition rules. You'll find them here: Twilight Struggle page at GMT (http://www.gmtgames.com/p-557-twilight-struggle-deluxe-edition-2015-reprint.aspx)
You can also download the monster strategy guide here: Twilight Strategy (https://leanpub.com/twilightstrategy)
Quote from: Pinetree on April 19, 2016, 10:15:00 AM
Get the 2015 edition rules. You'll find them here: Twilight Struggle page at GMT (http://www.gmtgames.com/p-557-twilight-struggle-deluxe-edition-2015-reprint.aspx)
Many thanks!
Barth's side of our game (or at least his thread for it -- I haven't read it yet, of course) has now started here (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=16777.0).
Don't forget B_C's single player AAR running on the front page. There's no group tag for them yet (two parts so far), so you'll have to scroll down through the AAR group to find them: http://grogheads.com/?cat=6
Quote from: Pinetree on April 19, 2016, 10:18:42 AM
You can also download the monster strategy guide here: Twilight Strategy (https://leanpub.com/twilightstrategy)
Thanks for posting that link, Pinetree.
Great site; I should have thought of posting it as I've been over there a few times over the years. The PDF, though, I didn't know about. The site apparently collected all their info and put it into one PDF, which is a free download, though they do ask for a donation if possible.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 19, 2016, 11:09:46 AM
Don't forget B_C's single player AAR running on the front page. There's no group tag for them yet (two parts so far), so you'll have to scroll down through the AAR group to find them: http://grogheads.com/?cat=6
Thanks for the plug, JP. I hope I can un-screw my game so it lasts longer than Turn 2. I haven't had time to continue it but I will hopefully be able to on Saturday.
I may have missed it, but has there been any word of release for Android? I haven't received anything from my kickstarter pledge that says anything about the Android version. Thanks.
I feel pretty sure I recall both Android and iOS versions on the way; but I've slept several times since backing the Kickstarter.
Loving this game. Genuine edge-of-the-seat moments and tension here. Got my money's worth. Great game.
This game is a classic, on par with Paths of Glory (another game I wish to see a PC version soon). Currently getting schooled by an experienced player on another forum. Now I am at least able to stand the distance against him.
Lord_Drakken, for those who want to hit me on TS,
A Groghead tournament perhaps, some day?
This game has probably the best UI of any computer "wargame" (loosly said) that I've ever played. It's very well done. I'm hoping that multiplayer will hold my attention longer than playing against the AI however.
I suck at this game, as my AAR on the front page shows. I've at least realized some of the major errors I made in Turn 1 (I hope I did, anyway).
Quote from: GJK on April 21, 2016, 07:54:26 PM
This game has probably the best UI of any computer "wargame" (loosly said) that I've ever played. It's very well done. I'm hoping that multiplayer will hold my attention longer than playing against the AI however.
One thing that print AARs can't get across well, even with visuals, is the quality of the UI. I'm trying hard to give readers an idea about that as I go. Even where I have a few complaints, generally there's a factor compensating for it somehow.
Example: the other player's move can go by way too fast to understand what's going on; sometimes it also looks as though influence played one place landed somewhere else. But there's a bar at the bottom which traces what happened during the turn, and clicking on the move will clarify where the influence was actually placed and how much of it. Plus this game history can be pulled up at any time. There's another nice window at the top of the screen which can be opened to show the cards played for each round of each turn, even though it doesn't show whether the cards were played for effect or whatever. I'm a bit miffed that the two windows have to complement each other (one window doesn't explain what the event on the card did or would have done; the other window doesn't explain whether the card was played as an event or what otherwise happened when it played) -- but I'm glad they exist, and they look super-clean and clear.
I never played the board game, so for me this is a very nice surprise.
I agree wholeheartedly on the UI and overall fun factor. But for me, the game's most amazing quality is that it somehow manages to be both highly abstracted yet wonderfully evocative. You're doing nothing but playing cards and roling dice, but it still feels like the Cold War. I suppose it helps to have lived through most of the era, but this game has that elusive "just feels right" quality.
I'm impressed.
I'm going to have to get this. Are any of you guys experiencing game ending bugs? Ive read some comments on the Steam forum where people cannot make it past certain turns.
I'm old enough to remember the drills for a nuclear attack in grade school. It was the same for a tornado. Get under a Formica desk with your hands over your head in a fetal position and kiss your ass goodbye.
At least the ashes would be in nice uniform piles.
And now, a sing-song. Why? Because I can.
Started and restarted a few games to get the feel of things, then dove into my first real game. And got crushed.
I was so busy worrying about Europe, the Middle East and Asia that I didn't pay attention to the AI buidling up a few points here and there in Africa and South America. Then they played both scoring cards in the same round - 14 VPs and I'm dead.
Most fun I've had getting obliterated in a long time.
Quote from: Queeg on April 23, 2016, 04:34:57 PM
Started and restarted a few games to get the feel of things, then dove into my first real game. And got crushed.
I was so busy worrying about Europe, the Middle East and Asia that I didn't pay attention to the AI buidling up a few points here and there in Africa and South America. Then they played both scoring cards in the same round - 14 VPs and I'm dead.
Most fun I've had getting obliterated in a long time.
....aaaaand I got crushed as well. Deeply crushed. Crushed as in the kids in Birmingham will be speaking Russian soon.
Just playing the tutorials now. What a complicated game. I think Ill have to run them again so it sinks in. The tutorials are very well done and I'm quite happy with the small cost of the game for such a unique experience.
Looks very interesting. I'll get it eventually. I have such a big stack of unplayed games already.
Getting this game to tomorrow. Going to record it, it looks SO DAMN GOOD.
Just got back home from vacation today. Despite 22 hours sitting at airports or flying and a 16 hour time change, first thing I did was grab a copy of the game.
I lost the first one due to stupidity on my part (played the Olympics at DEFCON 2, the AI boycotted and I was labelled the instigator of WWIII).
Second game was much better. I played as the USSR and scored a win on turn 5 by getting to +22 VP. The AI is actually fairly good. I'm pleasantly surprised. Who's up for a game?
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv320%2Fbogaty%2FTSvic_zpsj8aomv1o.jpg%7Eoriginal&hash=64c854f411cc64853f66885f056a80dbf4dda180)
:o ???
That's weird; I was sure the rule worked the other way, with the Olympic boycotter being responsible for moving the DEFclock down.
If the rule works as you reported, I sure dodged a bullet in my game against Bart: I played the Olympics for Ops, so the event didn't trigger, but since Bart has recklessly pushed us to DEF2 :knuppel2: by late Turn 2, had I played it for the VP attempt Bart could have won the game by boycotting the Olympics! (Whereas I would have thought he would lose the game by doing that, thus forcing him in that case to take the weighted risk in my favor of rolling for extra VPs.)
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 29, 2016, 07:30:33 AM
:o ???
That's weird; I was sure the rule worked the other way, with the Olympic boycotter being responsible for moving the DEFclock down.
If the rule works as you reported, I sure dodged a bullet in my game against Bart: I played the Olympics for Ops, so the event didn't trigger, but since Bart has recklessly pushed us to DEF2 :knuppel2: by late Turn 2, had I played it for the VP attempt Bart could have won the game by boycotting the Olympics! (Whereas I would have thought he would lose the game by doing that, thus forcing him in that case to take the weighted risk in my favor of rolling for extra VPs.)
It's whomever's turn it currently is (he who played the card) when the Defcon one is triggered gets the blame.... I was disappointed when you played it fer Ops.... ;)
Just picked this up and have only played through the tutorial once. The desktop icon was killing me, it has nothing connecting it to the game visually other than the letters T and S.
Boardgamegeek to the rescue: here is a nice icon to replace the TS one.
https://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/39703/twilight-struggle-icon
Tip that feller or at least give him a thumb :)
I've been reading about TS for ages, and with the Steam release I thought the time had come.
However, I waited for the Three Moves Ahead show about it, and while it's clearly one of their favourite games ever, I realised there is a lot of dice rolling (even if in the digital version it happens behind the scenes).
As someone who loathes Risk, I'm not sure now I would like TS... Do you feel like there is enough in there to make one overlook the luck factor?
Quote from: pfig on April 30, 2016, 12:01:04 PM
As someone who loathes Risk, I'm not sure now I would like TS... Do you feel like there is enough in there to make one overlook the luck factor?
I haven't had time to play the digital version, but, in the board game luck balances itself out. I played quite a few games and never felt the dice were influencing the game outside of the usual wildly lucky streak.
This is a very popular competitive tournament game, so I would imagine luck is not the primary game decider over a handful of games.
Actually the dice are not behind the scenes, but very much in-your-face. Cards are more important than dice rolls, and the real luck comes in the hand you are dealt. That said, there is real skill and strategy in digging your way out of a crappy hand of nothing but scoring cards and events that favor your opponent.
The dice definitely play a role, but the other layers of the game - the different card combinations/actions and the various country-specific modifiers that impact the dice rolls - reduce the feeling that's all random luck. The biggest "luck" factor, by far, is just the hand you get dealt. But fortunes of war....
I'm 0-6 agains the Soviet AI. But still having fun.
I downloaded it the same day I had major surgery, so I had two weeks in the hospital to learn how to get my butt kicked. I probably lost 6 games as the Americans and 5 as the Soviets, but at least now I can make it into the Late War period.
Stupid brain. Love having it fart on me and me screwing up DEFCON degrade vs. DEFCON improve in my addled noggin and then play a card during DEFCON 2 which hands a nuclear war win to the Soviets on turn 8 when I had +16 VP as the US.
:buck2:
Is anyone else finding that when the AI plays de-Staliniation, turn tine increases dramatically? I mean Pride of Nations slow. At first I chalked it up tp the fact that I was playing on an old laptop, but I find it happening on my desktop as well.
Just beat the AI for the first time (Turn 4). I had read somewhere that it didn't understand European Control, and other than a too-little-too-late attempt to keep me out of Poland just let me steamroll my way through.
Most of the game was played at Defcon 2 or 3, so it was just a matter of spending influence like a drunken sailor.
Thank you all for the clarification - I'll be getting it stat!
Quote from: tgb on May 01, 2016, 02:44:29 AM
Is anyone else finding that when the AI plays de-Staliniation, turn tine increases dramatically? I mean Pride of Nations slow. At first I chalked it up tp the fact that I was playing on an old laptop, but I find it happening on my desktop as well.
I had it happen once. Took about 5 minutes for the AI to decide where to relocate influence.
I am starting to see some patterns in the AI. I think with Europe that it reaches a max spending limit level and just decides it's not worth the effort to concentrate on it. It does seem to like dumping points into Africa early and goes nuts for Asia. In my last game, Thailand got up to 14 US and 12 USSR influence in it.
Quote from: pfig on April 30, 2016, 12:01:04 PM
As someone who loathes Risk, I'm not sure now I would like TS...
Since everyone else addressed the luck factor, allow me to mention: this is definitely NOT Risk -- aside from a very superficial physical resemblance of the map, the mechanics are a thousand percent different.
Am I the only person that doesn't loath risk? I remember my parents having it when I was a kid. I seem to remember, maybe incorrectly, the pieces were wooden in wooden boxes and just loving the map. When I became an adult I bought the game on a whim, played a few games and then moved on to Axis and Allies. Thus began my love of gaming.
100 posts! Wheres my ribbon?
I love Risk! I have four different iterations... three are just different vanillas. O0
Quote from: Barthheart on May 02, 2016, 09:56:43 PM
I love Risk! I have four different iterations... three are just different vanillas. O0
Risk is still light strategy fun, although I will only break it out when others demand.
I have two, still. From over a decade ago. Regular old 90s one with the horse & inf figures and the old LOTR one. Keep them for playing with the very youngest.
Haven't needed to in awhile since the gamer kids in the family have all graduated to bigger stuff. So the Risk games gather dust.
First game I've ever played that went to the final scoring phase.
Good times.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv320%2Fbogaty%2FTSUSWin_zpspezobt9r.jpg%7Eoriginal&hash=9e94789abf47e0e6ff42b5109c0237752feefb7a)