Is anyone else disturbed that they haven't updated their site since August ?
I don't intend to replace the HPS versions of Tiller games with JTS versions, but it's very annoying to see JTS updates that haven't migrated over to HPS.
I realize that there are two different sets of issues involved here and I'd rather not dissect them in public.
I own an awful lot of HPS games and it's distressing to think that for all intents and purposes they're not being supported.
It's one thing when a Tiller patch takes its own sweet time about coming out. I'm used to that. But when a patch doesn't seem to want to migrate from JTS to HPS, that's pretty hard to justify.
Quote from: Philippe on February 08, 2016, 01:09:24 PM
It's one thing when a Tiller patch takes its own sweet time about coming out. I'm used to that. But when a patch doesn't seem to want to migrate from JTS to HPS, that's pretty hard to justify.
Agreed :tickedoff:
Take it from me everything is fine.
Work constantly happens with regards to the TSS engine. It had to be moved to a whole new compiler which caused issues, plus lots of new stuff being worked on with regards to the engine aswell. I'm putting as much pressure on as possible to make sure 1 the next TU patch is well recieved and 2 the next game in the series is released in a far better condition than any of the others. Hence it's taking time.
If you wnat an update just email Scott at HPS. He will always respond to emails sent.
Can't speak for anything other than Squad Battles, but JT is selling AotR and ES with newer versions with a few change log adjustments than what HPS has.
I only know of these two cause I heard they were changed and I bought them again to see for myself. Other SB titles could be, but I ain't re buying again to see :knuppel2:
Eagles Strike: HPS 104a
JT:
QuoteChanges for Eagles Strike 1.05
- First John Tiller Software release.
- Added Weapons Off option under View Menu to hide discarded weapons on
the map.
- Added reliability 'X' for loads, weapons, and vehicles.
- Added Leader morale modification to assault morale (see Assaulting
in User Manual).
- Added Demoralize load effect which causes units to become
Demoralized or Disrupted (see Weapon Types in the User Manual).
- Changes that reduces protection and movement cost between adjacent
Trench hexes (see Users Manual under Movement and Firing).
- Added Inspirational Weapons in addition to Motivational Weapons.
- Added ability to sort data in the Database Editor.
- Added option for Mouse Wheel Zoom.
- Added hot key 'F' in main program to toggle Hold Fire.
Advance of the Reich: HPS 105
Just changed over to JT, but new patch number.
Changes for Advance of the Reich V1.06
Quote- Initial John Tiller Software release.
The reason Tiller split from HPS was because Scott at HPS didn't agree with the new DRM (the serial number) that John wanted to use. Scott isn't a fan of DRM:)
Quote from: TacticalWargames on February 08, 2016, 02:28:34 PM
The reason Tiller split from HPS was because Scott at HPS didn't agree with the new DRM (the serial number) that John wanted to use. Scott isn't a fan of DRM:)
Jason,
Think the "Tigers Unleashed" game is worth picking up?
Hi Richie61
I have Tigers Unleashed. It has a lot of depth. So much goes on under the hood. LOS, armour penetrations, weather and many other factors are taken into consideration. It is being worked on at the moment as TacticalWargames said. A lot of good improvements are being made.
It may not be for everybody. I enjoy it.
I see it as more of a simulator.
Regards
Tigers Unleashed info: Here (http://dogsofwarvu.com/forum/index.php/topic,1273.msg6844.html#msg6844)
Sorry for high jacking the thread :-[
Asid,
Thanks! Is TU more than say Squad Battles, but less than Panzer Battles?
Maybe I should learn Steel Beasts Pro since I have all the updates. :))
Apologies for posting this in your thread Philippe
Description
Tigers Unleashed is a unique, ultra-realistic tactical/grand-tactical level combat simulation set on the Eastern Front of World War Two between 1939-1942. It is a strategy-type game, where the player assumes the role of a combat Task Force Commander responsible for anything from a ski infantry company to a heavy panzer battlegroup. The basic units are squads and platoons, which are used as building blocks to create larger units.
TU has so much more than any of the titles you mentioned Richie. It takes so many factors into consideration. This is reflected in the turn resolution times. It is being constantly updated and is just getting better.
Regards
Quote from: TacticalWargames on February 08, 2016, 01:31:51 PM
If you wnat an update just email Scott at HPS. He will always respond to emails sent.
That's not the point. Assuming he could send me updates for Tiller games that are not available on the HPS site, what possible justification can there be for not posting them so that they are available for everyone?
This is not about my getting the HPS version of JTS patches, this is about justifying the delay in the public availability.
And frankly, from the point of view of best professional practices, on the surface it doesn't look very good.
He relies on JT to give him the updates. He obviously hasn't been given them if they aren't up. I will ask him about it.
Quote from: Richie61 on February 08, 2016, 04:09:43 PM
Sorry for high jacking the thread :-[
Asid,
Thanks! Is TU more than say Squad Battles, but less than Panzer Battles?
Tigers Unleashed is neither. It's like a 2D Combat Mission or Command Ops. It is the WW2 version of Point of Attack 2.
I have both POA2 and TU. Neither are what I would call functional wargames right now. It is a long sorry saga of updates that fix things and break things. You can play with it as kind of sandbox, but as a game, still needs a lot of fixing.
And the worst part is POA2 was somewhat functional until TU was released and POA2 was updated. Minimal communications with customers, various community members trying to push for fixes, fairly expensive games, etc. I have pretty much given up. A great idea that was too much for one guy.
Quote from: TacticalWargames on February 08, 2016, 02:28:34 PM
The reason Tiller split from HPS was because Scott at HPS didn't agree with the new DRM (the serial number) that John wanted to use. Scott isn't a fan of DRM:)
Same reason I've only purchased from the HPS site.
If those are behind an update, then so be it. I can deal with lagging behind if it means I don't have to deal with that online activation DRM BS.
I'm pretty sure the newest patches for JTS games do away with the online serial number activation.
Quote from: Bison on February 08, 2016, 07:34:22 PM
I'm pretty sure the newest patches for JTS games do away with the online serial number activation.
Patches don't require an activation, but AFAIK the games still require the serial number right after installation.
I own both Decisive Action and POA2. I've never been able to figure out DA, and it has to be run in a fixed resolution making it basically unplayable on anything with a graphics card produced in the past decade. I would still rather install and try and play DA than spend another minute on POA2. POA2 is why I refuse to try Tigers Unleashed. I agree with Ryan - good ideas, but there's no game there.
I think it's a damn shame that HPS can't get their hands on a newer version of DA to distribute. I know that they exist; the sim is still very much in use in the Army today and has been updated.
Had a reply from Scott. He said if he was given them he'd put them up. So obviously he hasn't been sent them by JT. So I'd take it up with him.
Regarding the patches for HPS games.
It seems that to update existing titles you may have to buy them again from JT :tickedoff: If this is the case then i think it is very harsh for the people who have the HPS version.
Quote from: Asid on February 09, 2016, 07:07:56 AM
Regarding the patches for HPS games.
It seems that to update existing titles you may have to buy them again from JT :tickedoff: If this is the case then i think it is very harsh for the people who have the HPS version.
No way I re-buy the many HPS titles I enjoy just so I can get updated patches. This one's a head-scratcher.
I don't believe that Tiller is intending to cut off HPS from patches. In the past, HPS has always received them, and usually within days/weeks of the JTS patch.
It sounds like from what I've picked up in discussions elsewhere that John Tiller himself is extraordinarily busy right now with the work he's doing for their government contracts. What development time he does have (and virtually all development of the engine is done by Tiller himself) is probably going to getting the first patch out for Battles of Normandy. BoN has been a big seller for JTS and is where the momentum is right now, so from a business perspective it makes sense that it would get attention over AoR or ES, for example.
So, I doubt there's a conspiracy here to deprive HPS of patches. It's probably the same thing that always happens in this hobby: the companies are small, there's a one or two person bottleneck on production, and a decision is made to focus on something that leaves something else delayed. This happens pretty much weekly in this hobby.
I agree, it sucks that the HPS games aren't patched. I have a pile of them too and recently bought more when Rich Hamilton had a bunch for sale on eBay. AoR and ES are two of the games I have as HPS versions. Until I see some announcement though, I'm not going to assume this is an intentional move to deny the patches to HPS so JTS can resell the games.
Well Scott can only upload what's sent him. He to is very busy plus on off health issues so hasn't the time to keep checking then asking for updates I suppose. Anyway he said if they get sent him he'll upload them.
Quote from: TacticalWargames on February 09, 2016, 11:31:33 AM
Well Scott can only upload what's sent him. He to is very busy plus on off health issues so hasn't the time to keep checking then asking for updates I suppose. Anyway he said if they get sent him he'll upload them.
Certainly not Scott/HPS's fault either. He's in the exact same boat.
I suggest you drop Rich Hamilton a note via the support page here;
http://www.johntillersoftware.com/Support.php
In a number of cases John has added a version number for the John Tiller Release, but there is nothing else changed. The example Richie61 gave for Advance of the Reich is a good example.
In other cases there may have been updates to the engine that needs to be pushed out. A few years back Rich & John did a massive exercise to bring everything up to the same level and it was no small task. There was something like 60+ games reviewed with the number doubled for both the HPS & JTS version - it was a lot of patches.
As Panzerde says, John is busy. He just announced that he has won another 3 year air force contract and that means less time to spend on commercial war games. The good news is that John does the programming side, but increasingly we're driving content, art and other areas within the development teams, which means John is only needed for short periods of time.
David
This thread was brought to my attention so I wanted to comment.
First off, at no time have we (JTS) ever directed or desired a customer to re-purchase a game directly from us that they had previously purchased through HPS Simulations. That is not our policy now, nor will it be in the future. We have, and will continue to, convert customers for free to the JTS versions of our games after verifying their proof of purchase, if they desire.
On-line activations have also been mentioned. They are required once - when the game is installed, and at no time there after on that computer. No continued Internet connection is required.
Another common thing I have seen, though not specifically mentioned here, is the ability to save the installer before installing the game. This can & should be done and then make a backup copy in the event you need to reinstall, or install on another computer you own. You do not have to get back with Support to re-download as a policy...only if you don't save the file to being with.
As for patches, the reasons have been touched on by others here. We're a tiny development house with limited resources. We currently have 80 titles published that we support, with 60+ of those being originally released through HPS Simulations. Maintaining two versions of each update for 60+ games is a pretty big task and to a certain extent removes resources from other things that need done. And given our practice of supporting our games for well over a decade, through multiple Microsoft OS releases, video card changes requiring code updates and so on, we need to make the process as manageable as possible. So, as time progresses we will likely move to only offering updates through the JTS site. This gives us a streamlined support system and allows us to ensure our customers needs are met for the long haul.
Regards,
Rich
Rich,
Thanks for clearing thing up. Quick question- what verification is needed to convert an HPS game to it's JTS equivalent? I have several that were purchased so long ago all I have is the disk and jewel case.
^ Excellent question Stagger. And when is zoomed view coming to my beloved Early American Wars series? :)
Conversion sounds like the best solution for all around. But like (probably) everyone else here, I bought mine a very long time ago from different sources (some from J&R, most from Chris Dean). I think the only games I ever bought direct from HPS weren't Tiller games.
From a management point of view, anything less than 100% of people converting their HPS versions to JTS versions doesn't solve the problem. Eighty or ninety percent conversion still leaves you supporting two versions.
Quote from: Staggerwing on February 12, 2016, 06:52:53 AM
Rich,
Thanks for clearing thing up. Quick question- what verification is needed to convert an HPS game to it's JTS equivalent? I have several that were purchased so long ago all I have is the disk and jewel case.
An order confirmation email is best all the way around, but I do realize not everyone is as big a packrat as me. ;) I also have a database I can query, and if all else fails a simple picture of your cd will suffice. Specific questions should be directed to Support@johntillersoftware.com - as I don't comb the forums like I used to...just don't have the same amount of free time.
Pix with Disk I can definitely supply! Thanks again Rich!
Dude, come on, no one wants to see your disk pix!
Quote from: panzerde on February 12, 2016, 07:58:20 PM
Dude, come on, no one wants to see your disk pix!
All the hits on my pay-view webcam URL say otherwise...
Quote from: panzerde on February 12, 2016, 07:58:20 PM
Dude, come on, no one wants to see your disk pix!
Has to one of the cleverest comments I have ever seen. You win the internet today.
Quote from: Staggerwing on February 12, 2016, 08:00:57 PM
Quote from: panzerde on February 12, 2016, 07:58:20 PM
Dude, come on, no one wants to see your disk pix!
All the hits on my pay-view webcam URL say otherwise...
You know, Rule 34 always wins!
BTW, thanks for the information Rich. I had no idea I could upgrade my HPS versions to JTS versions. Now I'm doubly glad I bought a bunch of them from you on eBay over the past year!
Quote from: RyanE on February 12, 2016, 08:24:01 PM
Quote from: panzerde on February 12, 2016, 07:58:20 PM
Dude, come on, no one wants to see your disk pix!
Has to one of the cleverest comments I have ever seen. You win the internet today.
Thanks Ryan!. :) God knows I needed to win something today!
Quote from: Staggerwing on February 12, 2016, 06:22:12 PM
Pix with Disk I can definitely supply! Thanks again Rich!
Yeah - but I have all those games. That's 60+ all bought from NWS
It may not be as bad as all that. There aren't that many games on the JTS update page, and many of them only exist in JTS form.