Just flashed on Fox:
Quote
CIA Director David Petraeus on Friday submitted his letter of resignation to President Obama.
The move was announced in a statement by Director of National Intelligence James Clapper.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/09/petraeus-resigns-as-cia-director
Apparently an extra-marital affair.
Personally, I don't equate an extra-marital affair with job incompetence. Unless the Director of the CIA had been caught in a Honey Trap, I don't think that it rates resignation. Unless it is a convenient excuse.
Extra-marital affair my a$$.
I'm sure someone's going to try to tie this to the delusional fantasy that everyone wanted to go into Benghazi with guns blazing, but was told to sit down and shut up by the Prez. There are no legs to that story, but it'll keep circulating...
Quote from: Centurion40 on November 09, 2012, 03:28:11 PM
Personally, I don't equate an extra-marital affair with job incompetence.
It's not equivalent to incompetence.
However, it opens up a problem with OPSEC. Having an affair is a substantial secret - one that opens you potentially to blackmail. It's my understanding that no one serving in the military is allowed to have an affair and I would expect a similar restriction in the intel agencies. It is certainly not acceptable for the man leading the CIA to have such an affair if indeed it is prohibited, and it's a poor example even if it is tolerated.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 09, 2012, 03:37:32 PM
I'm sure someone's going to try to tie this to the delusional fantasy that everyone wanted to go into Benghazi with guns blazing, but was told to sit down and shut up by the Prez. There are no legs to that story, but it'll keep circulating...
Put me under that delusional fantasy crowd. It's the first thing I thought of when I saw the headline. Clearly I was wrong.
Well, it is interesting that he was slated to testify next week, but now with his resignation "effective immediately", he won't be?
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2012/11/09/CIA-Director-Petraeus-Resigns
I imagine the Republicans won't just let him fall on his sword and fade away...
Quote from: LongBlade on November 09, 2012, 04:01:27 PM
Quote from: Centurion40 on November 09, 2012, 03:28:11 PM
Personally, I don't equate an extra-marital affair with job incompetence.
It's not equivalent to incompetence.
However, it opens up a problem with OPSEC. Having an affair is a substantial secret - one that opens you potentially to blackmail. It's my understanding that no one serving in the military is allowed to have an affair and I would expect a similar restriction in the intel agencies. It is certainly not acceptable for the man leading the CIA to have such an affair if indeed it is prohibited, and it's a poor example even if it is tolerated.
Never thought of that before. Makes sense.
Its sad someone so capable would put themselves out of service.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on November 09, 2012, 04:55:27 PM
Never thought of that before. Makes sense.
In fairness, I wouldn't have thought of it either. A buddy of mine in the military made that case to me when the Lewinsky scandal broke. At the time I was a big Clinton fan. We can argue whether a president should be held to the same standard as the military - or not. But the reasoning behind the policy seems sound.
"Seems" being the operative word. Some days I wonder if, in our quest for zero mistakes, we don't sacrifice a great many highly competent people in the process. As they say, no risk no reward.
A lot of recent removals of ship captains in the USN has not been for incompetency, but for zipper control.
Part of this is due to the pressure a captain can use to get a young, inexperienced person to share sexual favors.
It is also long standing rules, from the days of Sail. Sailors on long voyages have always been randy, a girl in every port. But officers were held to a higher standard.
They were considered ambassadors of their country, and held accountable for all lapses.
Gotta love the Daily Caller's headline about this: "Double Agent."
They sure have a way with words :)
In a strange coincidence I ran across an article a couple of days ago that mentioned a general who was fired for sexual harassment. At the time the article didn't mention a name. When the Petraeus story broke I thought it might be him, but looking back I found an article which clarifies it definitely was not.
Weird. Two similar stories (sorta) break withing a couple of days of each other.
QuoteU.S. Army prosecutors unveiled a laundry list of charges Monday against a one-star general they say sexually abused women who worked under him.
Brig. Gen. Jeffrey Allen Sinclair, 50, was accused of brazen harassment of four women since 2008, including forcing them to send sexually explicit photos of themselves to him and in one case using his Army rank to compel a sexual relationship be continued, prosecutors said.
Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2012/11/05/Army-general-charged-with-sex-abuse/UPI-42421352142792/
I'm afraid it's another case of "just because you can doesn't mean you should."
And also probably someone who thinks the rules seem to apply to everyone but them.
maybe hes using the one story as cover so he can 'retire', fade away and take command of GI Joe.
I'm trying to figure out what the headline would be if he had had two girlfriends.
Would it be a "triple agent" or would he be a "double, double agent"? 8)
Quote from: LongBlade on November 09, 2012, 07:23:40 PM
I'm trying to figure out what the headline would be if he had had two girlfriends.
Would it be a "triple agent" or would he be a "double, double agent"? 8)
Not sure. However, now he is a Free Agent.
Quote from: LongBlade on November 09, 2012, 06:26:15 PM
In a strange coincidence I ran across an article a couple of days ago that mentioned a general who was fired for sexual harassment. At the time the article didn't mention a name. When the Petraeus story broke I thought it might be him, but looking back I found an article which clarifies it definitely was not.
Weird. Two similar stories (sorta) break withing a couple of days of each other.
QuoteU.S. Army prosecutors unveiled a laundry list of charges Monday against a one-star general they say sexually abused women who worked under him.
Brig. Gen. Jeffrey Allen Sinclair, 50, was accused of brazen harassment of four women since 2008, including forcing them to send sexually explicit photos of themselves to him and in one case using his Army rank to compel a sexual relationship be continued, prosecutors said.
Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2012/11/05/Army-general-charged-with-sex-abuse/UPI-42421352142792/
I'm afraid it's another case of "just because you can doesn't mean you should."
And also probably someone who thinks the rules seem to apply to everyone but them.
The Sinclair case is all over the news here b/c our local channels also cover Fayetteville, and Sinclair is based out of Ft Bragg. If even 1/2 of what's alleged of Sinclair is true, he's right-and-proper-fooked for life
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 09, 2012, 07:59:40 PM
The Sinclair case is all over the news here b/c our local channels also cover Fayetteville, and Sinclair is based out of Ft Bragg. If even 1/2 of what's alleged of Sinclair is true, he's right-and-proper-fooked for life
Yup. Just ran across a couple of articles alleging he was under investigation for sharing emails with her while in A'stan.
The FBI surveilled him for apparently his entire time at the CIA.
Even worse? Apparently after they had their case they were asked not to bring it until after the election so as not to interfere with the results.
Seriously? How is that allowed to happen? Rumors on the news is that Holder is thinking of leaving Justice. Can you spell f-a-l-l-g-u-y?
QuoteStill, the FBI, Justice Department, and the White House held off on asking for Petraeus' resignation until after the election. His resignation occurred three days after the election, avoiding the possibility that Obama's ill-fated appointment of Petraeus could become an issue in the election.
FBI agents on the case were aware that such a decision had been made to hold off on forcing him out until after the election and were outraged.
"The decision was made to delay the resignation apparently to avoid potential embarrassment to the president before the election," an FBI source says. "To leave him in such a sensitive position where he was vulnerable to potential blackmail for months compromised our security and is inexcusable."
Source: http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/petraeus-resigns-cia-affair/2012/11/09/id/463573
Also heard a rumor she got preggers while over in the sandbox. Hmmm.
This story really makes me sad.
When I was at Centcom, I would brief him (or whoever was senior when he was out of town) every morning during the daily commander's brief. What was cool about that was that afterwards, I would go back to the watch floor and they would stream the commander's brief on one of the big screens on the watch floor. Very frequently, after some interesting piece of intel he would go on pretty long monologues about fighting the war, and I was always absolutely enthralled listening to him speak. He was very, very intelligent and I always felt like I was extremely priveleged to get that inside look on how things worked. I don't know a good analogy...I guess it would be like if you were a super computer nerd and you got to listen to Steve Jobs talk off the cuff about computer design every morning.
Even though I know he wouldn't be able to pick me out of a crowd, I found him extremely charismatic and he really inspired loyalty in me. This story disappoints me because he is so brilliant, has had an absolutely outstanding career, and this poor judgement must be devastating to him personally.
The whole thing is just a bummer. I know what he did is wrong, but he's still a hero in my book.
Quote from: Centurion40 on November 09, 2012, 03:28:11 PM
Personally, I don't equate an extra-marital affair with job incompetence.
the fail is not the affair, the fail is to let it slip out
if the director of the CIA is not able to hide 'his' little secret with OPSEC, before other agencies casual checking routine and the press, he is lacking some basic tradecraft in the gumshoe/spook's -biz.
...also he should know looong before, when his cover may getting blown and just move forward: separate from the wife (i bet the marriage was over anyway) and make the girlfriend official.
so i bet its a smoke granate to hide some other political reasons?
Petraeus knew his stuff in my book
The issue is not just an OPSEC issue for the leader, it's retaining his ability to enforce the standard on those who work for him where OPSEC does matter.
How can Petraeus sit at the top of an organization, having endured lesser consequences for his affair, when someone below him gets rightly fired for having an affair that might legitimately be an OPSEC issue?
And word coming out now is that the affair was with the women who wrote his biography (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/09/source-cia-director-david-petraeus-submits-resignation-over-extra-marital-affair/). No wonder it was such a positive book! ;)
no doubt she got to know they hardness of his character.
Character? Is that what the kids are calling it nowadays? ;-)
the firmness of his manhood?
Softness of his judgement.
Length of his service?
we shall leave no thread un-punned!
More questions arise. Pat Buchanan is speculating as to why Petraeus testified that there was a protest when clearly none had happened.
Quote"Now, here's Gen. Petraeus's problem, and as you've alluded to — It's September 14. September 11, his own safe house in Benghazi, with a couple of hero SEALs there, who, went over also to the compound — they were killed in a firefight on and off that lasted seven hours. Are you telling me that the head of the CIA did not know three days later that this was a firefight and an al-Qaida attack and he thought it was a protest over a video?"
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/11/10/pat-buchanan-asks-whether-cia-blew-it-with-initial-field-investigation-of-petraeus/
Premature commentation?
obama did ask to vote for revenge.
best headline yet
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.gawkerassets.com%2Fimg%2F184vm1zcrzak8jpg%2Foriginal.jpg&hash=f42caa3031b02ece97f5e0796174f6e37ab46169)
Hoo boy. It's like a Greek tragedy. Hero brought down by hubris. What a shame.
Though I will say I think he got more lucky than smart with the flip of Al-Anbar. Had the tribal elders not decided to back the US, we'd still be there.
Still, he was an exemplary soldier with a distinguished career. Sad to see him fall.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 10, 2012, 07:42:30 AM
And word coming out now is that the affair was with the women who wrote his biography (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/09/source-cia-director-david-petraeus-submits-resignation-over-extra-marital-affair/). No wonder it was such a positive book! ;)
The pen truly is mightier than the sword. An unstoppable General. A few strokes and its all over...
Quote from: bayonetbrant link=topic=3522.msg77741#msg77741.
No wonder it was such a positive book! ;)
isn't the title "All in" ;)
...and now her 'gun model' pics ;D
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F24.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_mdaelhrRq11qzt564o2_400.gif&hash=a00ff6e15c26316319a3ed87af4eca491920c8e1)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F24.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_mdaelhrRq11qzt564o4_400.gif&hash=0507571c699218918e2afb9bd80338112d9f8eac)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_mdaelhrRq11qzt564o3_400.gif&hash=ecb84c81f447d1194a18d4fdd710c58dcbfd3840)
The heads of both the House and Senate intel committees are concerned about how the Petraeus investigation was handled.
Quote"We received no advanced notice. It was like a lightning bolt," Feinstein said, adding she thought the Petraeus affair was "something that could have had an effect on national security."
"I think we should have been told," the California Democrat said.
"It just doesn't add up," King, R-New York, said on CNN. "You have this type of investigation. The FBI investigating e-mails, the e-mails leading to the CIA director, and taking four months to find out that the CIA director was involved. I have real questions about this. I think a timeline has to be looked at and analyzed to see what happened."
source: http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/11/rep-king-says-petraeus-story-just-doesnt-add-up/
I feel sad about this too. I live in Petraeus' home town. We were all very proud to have him become so high profile and important as a general and then at the CIA. I hope he can eventually come back into the fold some how.
And if anyone has seen pictures of Mrs. Petraeus...well, not that I am condoning adultery, but things will become clearer. His biographer is a supermodel compared to his wife.
Its all a mistake. She tripped in front of his desk. His face got wedged in her cleavage. When the others entered the room he was merely trying to withdraw.
Now let him back to work.
Check the pics...definitely NOT a mistake.
With no disrespect to the lady the thing is that this
is like he was caught stealing from petty cash or fudging
his expense claim. A basic violation of principle and trust
and an incredible demonstration of poor judgement - and
then Getting Caught. He was responsible for a lot more
than keeping his zipper done up what else got undone?
She is under investigation herself for having had access to confidential emails that she shouldn't have seen.
Quote from: Staggerwing on November 11, 2012, 09:34:32 PM
She is under investigation herself for having had access to confidential emails that she shouldn't have seen.
She also was allegedly sending intimidating emails to another woman whom she thought was interested in her man...
This is going from worse to worser.
- Head of the CIA's email compromised (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1081.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj349%2Flongblade%2FSmilies%2Fcheckmark-icon.gif&hash=e48add03cd7ec17c67c153ac5cd29e2d868e9c01)
- Having a prohibited affair (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1081.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj349%2Flongblade%2FSmilies%2Fcheckmark-icon.gif&hash=e48add03cd7ec17c67c153ac5cd29e2d868e9c01)
- Girlfriend accused of sending intimidating emails (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1081.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj349%2Flongblade%2FSmilies%2Fcheckmark-icon.gif&hash=e48add03cd7ec17c67c153ac5cd29e2d868e9c01)
- Timing of investigation possibly tampered with to affect political campaign (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1081.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj349%2Flongblade%2FSmilies%2Fcheckmark-icon.gif&hash=e48add03cd7ec17c67c153ac5cd29e2d868e9c01)
Two thoughts:
- No wonder Holder is getting out of the law enforcement business.
- What's next?
those big green check marks are soooo mod-like.
its sexy!
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on November 11, 2012, 10:22:57 PM
those big green check marks are soooo mod-like.
its sexy!
You should see my red stiletto X's.
It turns out that the reason there was an investigation was because the biographer was sending email threats to another woman that she was jealous of, a friend of the Petraeus Family. Otherwise the affair might have stayed a secret for quite a while longer. The whole thing is just sad. I'm actually feeling pissed that we have to lose his talent just when we could really use it.
It's getting worse.
Not only did Petraeus' g/f have access to his email, but she apparently was discussing classified info that she wasn't supposed to know.
QuoteBroadwell went on to explain more sensitive details from the Benghazi attacks, particularly concerning what the real cause might have been.
"Now, I don't know if a lot of you heard this, but the CIA annex had actually, um, had taken a couple of Libyan militia members prisoner and they think that the attack on the consulate was an effort to try to get these prisoners back. So that's still being vetted."
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/12/petraeus-mistress-may-have-revealed-classified-information-at-denver-speech/
But it turns out that having some prisoners at the CIA annex may have been the real reason for the attack on the annex (from the same source as above).
QuoteA well-placed Washington source confirms to Fox News that there were Libyan militiamen being held at the CIA annex in Benghazi and that their presence was being looked at as a possible motive for the staged attack on the consulate and annex that night.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/12/petraeus-mistress-may-have-revealed-classified-information-at-denver-speech
Interesting questions that need some answers. http://video.foxnews.com/v/1961392548001/
Pretty inflammatory rhetoric but important none the less.
Quote from: Longdan on November 12, 2012, 11:22:16 AM
Pretty inflammatory rhetoric but important none the less.
Yeah, some tough language. But there are some tough inconsistencies around this whole thing, not helped by a news blackout by most organizations before the election.
It would appear as though one of the women involved in this scandal has attempted to secede from it.
QuoteThe South Tampa woman connected to the Gen. David Petraeus scandal has called police to her home several times in the last few days, and at least once tried to invoke "diplomatic protection."
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/11/13/jill-kelley-requested-diplomatic-protection-in-911-call/
This actually ran on a TV station in Denver
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a85V_Sqt8Yo
someone is soooooooo in trouble.
Here's an interesting tie-in with a NY Times ethics column (http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8624514/chuck-klosterman-david-petraeus-scandal-living-cia-conspiracy-theory) back in July...
QuoteMy wife is having an affair with a government executive. His role is to manage a project whose progress is seen worldwide as a demonstration of American leadership. (This might seem hyperbolic, but it is not an exaggeration.) I have met with him on several occasions, and he has been gracious. (I doubt if he is aware of my knowledge.) I have watched the affair intensify over the last year, and I have also benefited from his generosity. He is engaged in work that I am passionate about and is absolutely the right person for the job. I strongly feel that exposing the affair will create a major distraction that would adversely impact the success of an important effort. My issue: Should I acknowledge this affair and finally force closure? Should I suffer in silence for the next year or two for a project I feel must succeed? Should I be "true to my heart" and walk away from the entire miserable situation and put the episode behind me? NAME WITHHELD
If you subscribe to the 'politics of distraction' theory of governance, what is the Petraeus scandal being used to hide?
Bengazi incident?
Voter fraud during last week's election?
Austerity protests in Europe?
Quote from: eyebiter on November 14, 2012, 08:22:57 AM
If you subscribe to the 'politics of distraction' theory of governance, what is the Petraeus scandal being used to hide?
Bengazi incident?
Voter fraud during last week's election?
Austerity protests in Europe?
It doesn't have to be a deliberate distraction. There is some substance to it.
But we should not let it distract us (however inadvertent it might be) from Benghazi.
There have been isolated reports of voter fraud, but so far nothing to suggest the results of the election were impacted - one way or the other.
Austerity protests in Europe take a back seat to big US domestic issues. I don't think this is anything new.
Glad to see that he will be testifying...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/14/petraeus-agrees-to-testify-on-libya-before-congressional-committees/
Apparently not everyone believes he's the genius he's cracked up to be.
MacGregor has posted a blistering (and long) op/ed piece on Petraeus. I will quote just a sample, but it's worth the time to read through all of it.
QuoteDirecting air strikes, raids and patrols from the safety of the Green Zone, a place that compares favorably with any number of elaborate shopping malls and motels in the United States, is not waging war. Suppressing hostile Muslim populations that resent Western occupation is not the same as confronting the Waffen SS in the Ardennes or hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops on the Korean Peninsula. In Iraq and Afghanistan, there are no opposing armies, air forces or air defenses.
In truth, only a fraction of the soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines who deploy, are ever under fire. Their courage and devotion are never in question, but confusing them with generals is tantamount to equating senators and Wall Street Bankers with American citizens struggling to survive the economic meltdown. In such an artificial war environment, sacred cows like Petraeus are never slain, they simply vanish.
In addition, Petraeus made a common mistake that is all too common in the Army's four star ranks. He concluded he was the smartest guy in the room and he made sure everyone in the room knew it. Petraeus was always one of those guys who wanted to be a general for the sake of being a general and he was prepared to do anything to secure the stars,[xv] the product of extreme careerism coupled with the façade of false humility. President Bush and the Neocons in his administration needed a "hero," an alleged "great captain" to make the case for victory in Iraq when there was none.
Source: http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/11/14/epitaph-for-a-four-star/
Is Jill Kelley really just an foreign agent who happened to make all the right connections?
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/is-one-of-the-women-in-the-petraeus-scandal-a-spy-youll-never-believe-whos-making-the-case/
I find it really obnoxious that critics are jumping on Petraeus now that he's down. Oliver Stone did the same thing on the Piers Morgan show a few nights ago. That's low. It's not his generalship that is being questioned here, it's his ethics and his ability to keep a secret. Two different things.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 06:55:19 PM
I find it really obnoxious that critics are jumping on Petraeus now that he's down.
I'm not so sure it's in the same league as Michael Moore.
I was hearing rumblings even as Iraq was being "won" that all was not as it appeared.
Petraeus wasn't a bad guy, but he didn't walk on water as he was often portrayed. Apparently not by a long shot.
^OK, but is now really the time for an opportunistic pile-on?
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 07:27:12 PM
^OK, but is now really the time for an opportunistic pile-on?
Perhaps not the best timing, but it is important to understand that Iraq was not won. The wheels are coming off of that bus in a bad way.
Iraq was won. The SOFA was lost and that is the difference you see today.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 07:27:12 PM
^OK, but is now really the time for an opportunistic pile-on?
Now is the only time that dissenting voices have been able to break through the wall of effusive praise.
Bullshit. Petraeus was a target before this story too. You might think his leadership in Iraq and afterward was overrated. I disagree. This behavior is garbage and unacceptable. However while it diminishes the man it does not diminish everything he did for this nation and its Armed Forces.
*I'm talking about Petraeus' behavior in having an affair*
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 07:59:46 PMIraq was won. The SOFA was lost and that is the difference you see today.
I agree that the SOFA was lost, but I'm wondering by what metrics it was established that Iraq was "won". This is probably a separate thread, but let's face it - there was never a terribly succinct and over-arching mission statement for the invasion of Iraq against which to judge success / failure.
We did a lot of great things there, and certainly more than most people want to give the US military credit for, but I don't know that we can assess whether or not we "won" for at least another 10-15 years, if that.
I just don't like to see anyone kicked when he is already down. And that's what is happening.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 14, 2012, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 07:59:46 PMIraq was won. The SOFA was lost and that is the difference you see today.
I agree that the SOFA was lost, but I'm wondering by what metrics it was established that Iraq was "won". This is probably a separate thread, but let's face it - there was never a terribly succinct and over-arching mission statement for the invasion of Iraq against which to judge success / failure.
We did a lot of great things there, and certainly more than most people want to give the US military credit for, but I don't know that we can assess whether or not we "won" for at least another 10-15 years, if that.
I don't disagree. The problem is we won't get the 10-15 year metrics if there had been a SOFA put into place that would have kept American power filling the vacuum. The failure to secure a SOFA, for whatever reason or rational, essentially changed the long term prospects dramatically.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:06:56 PM
I just don't like to see anyone kicked when he is already down. And that's what is happening.
TBH we're not kicking him over the subject of his downfall - zipper control.
We're having what I view to be a legitimate discussion over his performance in Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't see being critical of that as kicking him.
Kicking him would be to trot out all the salacious facts about his fun under his desk. I have no interest in reviewing that.
But I still contend he got lucky in flipping Al-Anbar. Had that not gone our way we'd still be there.
The total withdrawal from Iraq snatched certain defeat from whatever victory we may have achieved there.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:06:56 PM
I just don't like to see anyone kicked when he is already down. And that's what is happening.
I'm disgusted by the behavior, but there is some serious political stink on this one that trandscends his marital indiscretions.
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 09:14:49 PM
there is some serious political stink on this one that trandscends his marital indiscretions.
Every time I turn on the TV something else takes us down a different turn.
This thing has more tentacles than a Cthulhu festival. I'm afraid it's just the tip of the iceberg and Petraeus is just one small part of it.
I'm not talking about anyone here, I'm talking about people like Oliver Stone coming out and saying Petraeus always sucked. That is kicking him when he is down.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:21:20 PM
I'm not talking about anyone here, I'm talking about people like Oliver Stone coming out and saying Petraeus always sucked. That is kicking him when he is down.
Well, Stone can suck big green Groginati $#%^!
I don't think bringing the Sunni leadership to the political table was all luck. Sure the right place, the right people, the right time were involved but the overall effort was not merely luck. It was promises, money, security, friendships offered and a hundred other reasons but luck didn't drive the strategy. The same things that have driven outcomes of political war since the dawn of time.
That's better LB. For the record I think Petraeus made his own luck, like Bison says above. And wtf is going on your avatar?
Rorschach from the Watchmen.
Dog carcass in alley this morning, tire tread on burst stomach. This city is afraid of me. I have seen its true face. The streets are extended gutters and the gutters are full of blood and when the drains finally scab over, all the vermin will drown. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the whores and politicians will look up and shout "Save us!"... and I'll look down and whisper "No." They had a choice, all of them. They could have followed in the footsteps of good men like my father or President Truman. Decent men who believed in a day's work for a day's pay. Instead they followed the droppings of lechers and communists and didn't realize that the trail led over a precipice until it was too late. Don't tell me they didn't have a choice. Now the whole world stands on the brink, staring down into bloody Hell, all those liberals and intellectuals and smooth-talkers... and all of a sudden nobody can think of anything to say.
Great graphic novel.
Back to the discussion folks. Back to the discussion.
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 09:23:46 PM
I don't think bringing the Sunni leadership to the political table was all luck. Sure the right place, the right people, the right time were involved but the overall effort was not merely luck. It was promises, money, security, friendships offered and a hundred other reasons but luck didn't drive the strategy. The same things that have driven outcomes of political war since the dawn of time.
I'm sure there was some skill, but I'm not convinced that the number of the surge really turned the tide as many claim. Maybe it pushed them over the edge. Or maybe it was the right bribe. I dunno. Maybe he convinced them we'd stick around until they gave up.
Anyway, as long as we're heaping more dung onto this oscillating propeller, I would like to bring up the question of privacy...
QuoteHere's a thought that might make even the most conscientious e-mail user nervous: "When the CIA director cannot hide his activities online, what hope is there for the rest of us?"
Source: http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/14/tech/petraeus-email-privacy/index.html?hpt=hp_c1
For a much longer list of questions as to what might be happening and whether it is appropriate: http://mobile.theweek.com/article/index/236326/what-the-heck-fbi
Well there was a dramatic difference between pre and post surge Iraq due to increased American capability and the Sunni Awaking. That is undeniable. Not sure what your question is to be honest.
Whether or not Oliver Stone should STFU.
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 09:40:46 PM
Well there was a dramatic difference between pre and post surge Iraq due to increased American capability and the Sunni Awaking. That is undeniable. Not sure what your question is to be honest.
Not sure I have a question. More of an observation - the "surge" per se didn't do much. I agree *something* must have triggered the flip. I was never convinced it was the surge. More likely a lot of hard work from everyone before that happened to have coincided with Petraeus showing up.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:50:14 PM
Whether or not Oliver Stone should STFU.
Nice avatar.
And I'm not just because Nimoy looks good on you.
Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:50:14 PM
Whether or not Oliver Stone should STFU.
Well yeah. That's been true for a long time now.
Nimoy also thinks Stone should STFU, FWIW.
All I know is you guys need to get your asses into Black Ops II.
We're done with L4D2??
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:57:13 PM
We're done with L4D2??
No. I'm thinking this Friday or Saturday for some late night zombie slaying.
Id like to take this moment and remind you that obama did ask for people to vote for revenge.
Kewl Bison, I'm around all weekend trying to decide what to play solo next: Warlock vs. Commander - The Great War. L4D2 will keep my mind off of this issue.
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 10:03:01 PM
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:57:13 PM
We're done with L4D2??
No. I'm thinking this Friday or Saturday for some late night zombie slaying.
I'm in!
Oh and another thread derailed! But it took until page six. Is that some kind of record?
Quote from: TheCommandTent on November 14, 2012, 10:09:26 PM
Quote from: Bison on November 14, 2012, 10:03:01 PM
Quote from: Gusington on November 14, 2012, 09:57:13 PM
We're done with L4D2??
No. I'm thinking this Friday or Saturday for some late night zombie slaying.
I'm in!
Oh and another thread derailed! But it took until page six. Is that some kind of record?
It's only a record if no one brings up boobs.
Boobs!
Well good luck with that. I've got my own gaming demons to battle.
tits or it didnt happen.
I ment pics. ::)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fblogs.miaminewtimes.com%2Fcultist%2Fscarlett_johansson_funny-boobs-tits.jpg&hash=fa033be84740883963ed78413a69fa25f339daf6)
Much better.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsubmad.com%2Fuploads%2Fposts%2F2012-07%2F1342409779_the-woman-with-the-worlds-largest-natural-breasts7.jpg&hash=ca3f2a23e1556e4ac4f4d7705629718b689caab8)
Disturbing.
go big or go bigger
I threw up a little in my mouth..... :-\
That's what she said. And by she I mean Azz.
The real shame here is that Petraeus isn't a Frenchman. If this happened in France, it would not have made the news- unless the chick was a Chinese spy or a member of Greenpeace.
Colbert's take on this is soooooooo good
http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/421326/november-15-2012/general-s-hospital
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 16, 2012, 08:59:46 AM
Colbert's take on this is soooooooo good
http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/421326/november-15-2012/general-s-hospital
Thanks for that, it was hilarious.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 16, 2012, 08:59:46 AM
Colbert's take on this is soooooooo good
http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/421326/november-15-2012/general-s-hospital
Meh. Maybe I need to move to Colorado. I thought it was fairly lowbrow.
^You tend to be very high brow and droll.
Like Fred Flintstone.
Quote from: Centurion40 on November 16, 2012, 03:55:07 PM
Like Fred Flintstone.
No kidding. A brontosaurus steak sounds pretty good right about now.
This week's SNL - they, uh... "nailed" it :)
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/c-span-booknotes-cold-open/1424394/
Guess who just lost her diplomatic impunity.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/26/world/asia/south-korea-kelley/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
Quote from: LongBlade on November 27, 2012, 08:55:40 AM
Guess who just lost her diplomatic impunity.
Freudian slip, or bad pun-ity?
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 27, 2012, 09:27:04 AM
Quote from: LongBlade on November 27, 2012, 08:55:40 AM
Guess who just lost her diplomatic impunity.
Freudian slip, or bad pun-ity?
I can't remember the exact phrase she tried to invoke when she called for help, but it wasn't "immunity." I think it was "impunity." Yes, it was deliberate ;)
Quote from: LongBlade on November 27, 2012, 09:29:06 AM
Quote from: bayonetbrant on November 27, 2012, 09:27:04 AM
Quote from: LongBlade on November 27, 2012, 08:55:40 AM
Guess who just lost her diplomatic impunity.
Freudian slip, or bad pun-ity?
I can't remember the exact phrase she tried to invoke when she called for help, but it wasn't "immunity." I think it was "impunity." Yes, it was deliberate ;)
Quote from: The article LongBlade linked in his post
"I am an honorary consul general," Kelley tells police on a recording of the call. "... I have inviolability. They should not be on my property. I don't know if you want to get diplomatic, uh, protection involved as well."
;)
Given the circumstances Inviolability is pretty funny.
I imagine it would help in prison. Too bad civilians can't
be disciplined for zipper control issues. (I know they can
in circumstances but you know what I mean.... I hope.... before
you unleash the hounds.) Anyway I am sure there are a few
senior officers wishing she had been done their biography.
"I wouldn't have gotten caught...."
cheers
Just ran across an interesting article that attempts to sum up Petraeus's performance in the two wars he oversaw.
It's an interesting read, if not exactly uplifting.
http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/atlarge/2012/12/17/121217crat_atlarge_filkins?currentPage=all
Makes you wonder about who was right and who was wrong
for the last ten years or so doesn't it? I direct this at the
reflective types of course. You Other Guys, yeah you were
right whatever..back to your deep thinking.
Quote from: Longdan on December 10, 2012, 04:15:57 PM
Makes you wonder about who was right and who was wrong
for the last ten years or so doesn't it? I direct this at the
reflective types of course. You Other Guys, yeah you were
right whatever..back to your deep thinking.
I wasn't right?
This is causing me to rethink
everything.
My Axe deodorant won't get me more chicks?
My laptop gaming rig won't help me pwn everyone in Black Ops II?
My Army Men pjs aren't the epitome of geek-chic?
Thanks, Dan, for this epiphany. I don't see how I was ever going to go on living that lie.
actually your Army Man pjs are the epitome of geek-chic.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on December 10, 2012, 04:25:20 PM
actually your Army Man pjs are the epitome of geek-chic.
Thanks. Nice try, but I know better now that Dan has shown me the light.
I'm starting to think that Canadian Bacon isn't bacon. Or Canadian!
Bisquick might not be the best method for making pancakes and biscuits!
Maybe pork
isn't the other white meat!
I feel so...so...liberated.
I thought Gus was the other white meat.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on December 10, 2012, 05:59:00 PM
I thought Gus was the other white meat.
Well, maybe if you are really, really trying to cut back on portion size......
I do not know why you thought I meant YOU weren't right?
Even though you are the Boss that certainly wasn't about you.
That was for the Rah! Rah! We're doin' Real Good!! crowd.
I should not have had to point out the "I've got a bad feeling about this..."
guys were right. Now I live in a fog of uncertainty. Why would you
include yourself in the nonreflective crowd?
Anyway I have Spiderman Underoos and they are Supreme.
^HAHA!! I'm all dark meat below the waist anyway.
Quote from: Steelgrave on December 10, 2012, 06:28:10 PM
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on December 10, 2012, 05:59:00 PM
I thought Gus was the other white meat.
Well, maybe if you are really, really trying to cut back on portion size......
Ouch! I felt that from here.
Quote from: Longdan on December 10, 2012, 06:52:41 PM
Why would you include yourself in the nonreflective crowd?
Thank God you think my tinfoil hat is non-reflective. I wasn't sure if the camo netting over it would counteract its thought control blocking attributes.
That wasn't what I said at all. The response puzzles me.
But since others knew what I was thinking and I didn't I'll just leave it at that.