DOOM

[Bronwell]

It looks like Alistair is requesting an immediate extension for Pythium.  I had initially assumed when he posted that he was referring to next turn.  I have no objection to the extension, but I hope someone sees this before turns post in less than 3 hours.

For what it's worth, the overall turn slowdown in the past month has definitely hurt my enthusiasm for this game.  It seems the first 40 turns flew by, but the last month or more came to a screeching halt.  It doesn't help that Dominions 4 has come out and I can only assume that I am not the only one spending a great deal of time testing it out.

I don't know how everyone else feels, but back to back to back to back turns of 4 day+ turns seems to have hurt interest in the game, simply looking at the fact that even with long extensions like the current turn, a majority are still waiting until the last minute to post turns.  I think what has surprised me most was that in my other MP, even though there was a 48 hour timer, approximately every 3rd turn or so would get rushed out in 6-7 hours or so as everyone just did back to back turns.  That has never seemed to happen in this game after the first 10 turns.  My other MP game started much slower than the current game, and had numerous stales, but with the exception of one 48 hour extension never really had any turns take longer than 60 hrs right up to the bitter end,  with most turns taking nowhere near the timer.  It could simply be that MP game finished during the summer when there were fewer real life demands.

I know I have certainly needed 2 small extensions and have taken advantage of several extensions granted to others.  I guess I was just surprised to see so many long turns in the last 5 weeks.  I figured after the game crashed we would try to speed things up after that long hiatus.  Instead it got worse.  This may be common in games.  My first MP is my only other experience.

I will do my best to stick this out to the bitter end, but if we are still averaging such long turns in November I may join Phobos in focusing on Dominions 4 and start looking for a sub.

[parone]

if two nations of your size quit, there won't be any subs, the game will just die.


It's pretty poor form to post:  'im gonna quite this game' IMO.  that doesn't show a lot of respect for the other people playing the game.

I was pretty much reconciled to irrelevance a long time ago in this game, but I still make the effort to get turns in.  that's what good(if not skilled ;)) players do.

[Phobos]

My delay is in part due to beta testing another game.  That should conclude over the next week.

The other reason for my delay is organising blood hunting and communions/sabbaths, which is fairly time intensive.  Other games I can complete turns fairly quickly, typically in one sitting.  With this game I have to force myself to sit down and go through everything manually, plus then double check everything to ensure everyone has their correct allocation of blood slaves and gems.  That is fairly time intensive and I don't often have the luxury of an hour or more to myself most evenings.

I have no problem with a 48 hour or 60 hour interval and have not staled yet, though I can understand the frustration of some players being forced to wait for me to complete a turn.  I can speed up my turn submissions if you like, but the performance of Jotunheim will likely suffer as a result (I have sent in some clumsy turns already, but I will probably hit a new level of fail if I have to rush). 

[Bronwell]

I'm was referring to something possibly occurring at least 6 weeks out, and would stay in the game to the bitter end if I still felt that way and could not find a sub then.  I never said "I'm quitting."  I certainly don't want the game to die, as I have enjoyed it and learned a lot from it.  I am thrilled to still even be relevant in the game after that early dogpile.

I did not think it unreasonable to point out that somehow it feels like our turn timer has effectively shifted from 48 hours to something more like 96 hours or more, with virtually no quick turns in between to keep interest in the game.  It is definitely possible I am the only one to feel this way. 

My son is one month from turning 2 years old, so I understand that unavoidable things come up, and have no problems at all with extensions whenever needed.  I brought up the subject because it feels like there is less interest in the game and it seems one of the best ways to renew interest would be by trying to speed up turns by getting turns in as soon as possible.

I know I for one generally feel no guilt about turning in my turn near the deadline when only 1 person has posted his turn in the first 43 hours and we have 5 hours remaining til post.  However, it is entirely different when I am last with even 24 hours left on the clock.  I believe I have only been last 3 times this whole game and one of those was the first turn as I didn't realize it had started.  I will try to get my turns in well before the deadline when possible to hopefully help facilitate faster turns.


As for your blood hunting, Phobos, I can relate.  I primarily play blood hunting nations.  My last MP was as Sauromatia, and they definitely add a substantial layer of micromanagement.  I don't wish to rush you at the expense of your turns.  I think I was simply expressing my frustration and surprise that we never seem to have a time, even on the weekend where we can all manage to get our turns in a 24 hour period, much less the occasional 8-hour window which occurred in my last game. 

tl;dr version is Don't worry about me quitting.  I will be here to the bitter end.  I would prefer turns to move a little faster when possible but will stick around regardless and certainly don't want anyone to feel guilty if real life gets in the way of gaming.

[Wingedflamez]

Tuesday morning was the last time it hosted.

[Haerdalas]

I agree with Bronwell. These constant delays and extensions are slowing the game down a bit too much. I admit I have asked for a few extensions myself, but only rarely. At this point though we very rarely get a turn of less than 48 hours length, let alone the 1/day we used to consistently get. I don't mean to rush anybody, but if people would try to get their turns done as soon as they have the time, rather than (as many, including myself, have recently been doing) not sending a turn in until just before the deadline, I think the resultant speed up would greatly improve interest in the game.

Right now, I am not doing very much in the game. I am sitting around gathering forces, building items etc. The problem is at the current speed... spending 4 turns (not very many) gathering men like I am doing takes the better part of 2 weeks real time. It is frustrating to wait for so long for something so mundane...

In response to this, I will be trying to get every turn in as soon as I can from now on, and I hope others will at least attempt to do the same.

[parone]

of course, you folks are right.  many games die this death as you get into the lategame-people just lose interest, and turns don't get done-causing others to lose interest.

I guess the idea of thrones in dom4 is supposed to address this phenomena, though I do not know how.

[Haerdalas]

I am not losing interest, even with these delays. Far from it actually - I have been playing the long game, and have several plans only just coming into fruition. What I am is frustrated. I feel that now we are firmly in the end game, things are only going to get more interesting. I just wish the pacing hadn't slowed down so much.

[Haerdalas]

The Llamaserver hasn't updated in over 9 hours, anyone know what is going on?

[Phobos]

Seems to be working fine.

[Haerdalas]

Yeah, don't know what the problem was but it was fixed, so never mind.

[Bronwell]

I am curious.  When did we switch to a 60-hour standard turn?  I remember moving quite some time ago to 48 hours, but I was surprised to see we now have 60 as standard.  With all the turn delays, I have not noticed the default timer was moved as well.

[alastair]

Turn will be in without any issues.

[Wingedflamez]

I believe it was Alistair who started having some personal issues and as such was going to need extra time between turns.  I think that was like 2 weekends ago? 

[Bronwell]

The reason I ask is that I looked back through the threads for at least a month, back to the server stale bug where we resent turn 43 and a few turns before that and saw no mention of the turns being moved to 60-hours, just many, many extensions.  I gather it must have happened earlier than that.

I would vote to move future turns back to 48 hours, just to hopefully keep the game moving along, still giving extensions freely as needed.  If others can't keep that schedule I understand.  As it happens my work should not be too bad the next few months.

I have to say I am surprise by how this game has progressed.  It is completely different from my other MP.  In that game, by midgame their were clear tiers, with a HUGE disparity between nation strengths, with one player out in front by every metric-research, gold, gems, etc, and with a huge gap between player 2 and player 3.  There was a similar gap between players 4 and 5, with players 5 and 6 holding on for dear life until their eventual termination, and nations 7 and 8 previously eliminated quite quickly.

In this game, while there are huge disparities in research, and moderate disparities in gems and gold, the disparity in provinces is remarkably small between 1 and 7.  I find it much more interesting, with every player still relevant this late in the game.