Battlefront's Combat Mission Eastern Front Sneak Peek

[Zonso]

I'm in. I love the way those Russian soldiers sit calmly on the back of their tanks while the arty's landing all around them. Must be the vodka.

Yeah I'm still in. The way the game keeps moving forward and allowing previous iterations to be kept current with the improvements is a huge win. Vodka or not, I do question the unflappable Soviet tank riders during that barrage and their determination to stay onboard, since it was standard practice for the Germans to fire artillery in such conditions in order to separate the tank riders from the tanks. We'll have to see if that behavior remains.

Having put a yeoman's effort into Graviteam's games more than once (they are pretty), I wonder about people's motive's when they say somehow it is comparable to CM when everything about Achtung Panzer is 'lite'. It doesn't do a fraction of what CM does and that's reflected in the gameplay, or lack thereof. CM has a myriad of tactical nuances mirroring real life that make for a great simulation and great game. The simulation is real world physics, polygon based. I recall one interesting tidbit related by the developer early on when they were trying to find out why the Tiger tank was not reacting or performing as expected. It was discovered the simulated tank commander was oriented the wrong way in the turret so its 'eyes' were not seeing what was directly in front of the tank!

For those having performance issues, I suggest trying the latest patch. The BFC second programmer has optimized and improved things immensely across the board, even for those that weren't having any issue.

[Zonso]

snip...

All games are not 'perfect' and some games are just not for some people <shrug>. However, your specific complaints are highly selective, along the lines of poo-pooing a beautiful beach because of some garbage floating in the water. Bad analogy perhaps but all I am capable of this morning!

AARs by nature are meant to be balanced competitively else where would be the interest? I find your meeting engagement comment also very odd, since that battle type comprises only a small part of what's offered, and again usually, from my experience, a staple for head-head quick battles because (you guessed it) they are balanced competitively. Try playing one of PaperTiger's campaigns if you want some historically accurate, unfair and brutal battles. It will likely leave you crying in frustration if you play through or turn you into a constant reloader. ;)

I agree about CM's situational awareness of tanks in WWII being seemingly too good. However, the charge of attacking tanks being also too good is unfounded without understanding the context, ie spotting and C&C. This is based on many, many hours of gameplay not an AAR.

Relative spotting is miles better than the old Borg spotting, hands down. Your charge of using Scout teams to gather intel you wouldn't normally get was just as valid in CMx1 as it is in CMx2. If you have an elegant solution to this type of gaminess, I'm sure the developers would love to hear it.

Yep there are occasional spotting anomalies. It sure does not detract from the game as a whole and I would imagine most reasonable people would say the same. Again successful games will garner a following, that doesn't mean it is for everyone.

[SgtRock]

I agree there are still major issues with spotting.

In CMSF - you see your tanks firing and hit targets you don't see, happens all the time.

In CMBN/CMFI - your tank spots an enemy tank, you pause to target/fire  on the enemy but, it can't get the blue line on it, even though it's spotted, you un-pause, enemy tank fires, your tank is dead.  Seeing an enemy but, unable to target/fire on it seems to happen all the time.

[Zonso]

Lol! Well then SgtRock with comments like 'major issues' and 'happens all the time' I profess you are in the unreasonable camp. Though that begs the question why you continue to purchase and play?? Here's a pro tip for you gratis, if your tank can spot something but you can't fire, it is likely the gunner has no los. Try shifting a little and I bet your tank will open up. :)

[mirth]

Lol! Well then SgtRock with comments like 'major issues' and 'happens all the time' I profess you are in the unreasonable camp. Though that begs the question why you continue to purchase and play?? Here's a pro tip for you gratis, if your tank can spot something but you can't fire, it is likely the gunner has no los. Try shifting a little and I bet your tank will open up. :)

Here's a pro tip for you gratis, try being a little less antagonist towards anyone who doesn't share your opinion.

[Nefaro]

For a fanbase that's infamous for lodging complaints about even the smallest little detail of the units portrayed, it's certainly a bit odd for one to call someone else "unreasonable" for pointing out some of the game's shortcomings.  ???

[Dolan50]

No Sale!
I'll stick to Graviteams APOS/GTOS game and the soon to be released Mius Front game which will have a newer engine to be released in early 2014 for my east front gaming needs.
There is even talk of adding a multi player aspect to Mius Front.

No one does east front tactical and grand tactical combat better.Nobody!
If they did then I would be buying and playing their product.
I seriously doubt anyone who actually learned to play APOS/GTOS will be looking to CMEF to fill their east front tactical gaming needs.

It looks like BF will be relying on the same old dwindling core customer base for sales of CMEF,per usual and no surprise there.
CMs glory days are over. There are much better products on the market today and CM hasn't been able to keep up and grasp that reality.

I hate to burst anyones bubble but micro managing individual soldiers and WEGO with a Gods eye view does not simulate real life WW2 tactics,especially at the platoon and above level and the tactical AI is no better in CM than APOS/GTOS it only seems that way because the CM maps are denser and smaller with no real room to manuever against the AI in CM.
Nice try though.

As far as 2 story buildings and hills. They are in APOS/GTOS if you really own and played it and bothered to look.
Another thing to consider is the game maps depict the Russian farmlands around Kharkov in the Ukrainian winter not Normandy summer bocage!
The maps are as close as possible to actual contour lines and terrain features for the battles that Graviteam has chosen.

The Devs live in Kharkov and have visited these battlefields countless times and used actual period 1/50,000 maps from the Russian Military archives to recreate them.

I'm sure if Graviteam wanted to add walls and bocage to their game they would do it right not because they can't do it or the game would fall apart because of it.

So what if all the houses look the same,at least you can destroy them and set them on fire. If and when Graviteam decides to go into the Urban combat environment you can be sure that every bldg. and brick wall will be portrayed as accurately as possible and deformable!
How can you accurately portray real life WW2 tactics and not have fire and blow up and destroy buildings or knock down trees.
And why are all the entrenchments and foxholes above ground?
Have they added cellars to the houses in CM yet?

Kind of ruins the real life protection and LOS aspects of these defenses.
So I'm not buying the whole mirrored RL tactics point.
That's like someone telling me Budwieser is the best beer because they drink it and like it!

CM is so sanitized it's like watching cartoon mission!
The graphics are crap and the so called "superior" gameplay doesn't alleviate that perception either.
So I'm also not swallowing that BF propaganda.

I could write pages of all the things I found unrealistic in CM and they may have addressed a few things since CMBN but I doubt any of the fixes are even close to actual realism or would make me care for that game anymore.
CM became a tedious chore to play and I'm much happier with Graviteams rendition of WW2 tactical combat.

BF is a slowly sinking ship and playing the band louder isn't going to cover up that fact or save it. Most of us jumped and abandoned the BF CM ship after CMBN was released and if BF can't update its game to more modern standards then it won't be long before the rest of the hanger ons get sucked under the waves along with it.
Maybe if BF is lucky Slithereen/Matrix will buy them out. Hell,they're like the same peas in the same pod anyways.

As far as I'm concerned Graviteam has no competition from CMEF and I'll wager it will hardly make enough money to support any of the other add ons that BF has planned for it either,much like how CMFI is now.

I get more bang for the buck from Graviteam then I could ever expect from a BF or Matrix product. You want to shell out the big bucks for a "superior" labeled branding with no basis in fact go ahead if you think that gives you some kind of an elite status.
I save money,play a quality product regularly that I enjoy and don't feel like a tool. That's what is more important to me.

[undercovergeek]

Not going to argue..... You're obviously on the other side of the fence and that's cool.... It's what makes discussions great but I'd reckon your argument would carry more weight if it wasn't spotted with facts you can't possibly know!

I'd listen to your counter argument more without the inside knowledge of battlefronts bank statements and customer numbers... none of which you dont have access to but I applaud your impassioned loyalty to your game as much as those that defend theirs

[SgtRock]

Lol! Well then SgtRock with comments like 'major issues' and 'happens all the time' I profess you are in the unreasonable camp. Though that begs the question why you continue to purchase and play?? Here's a pro tip for you gratis, if your tank can spot something but you can't fire, it is likely the gunner has no los. Try shifting a little and I bet your tank will open up. :)

Oh, too late the enemy shoots and your tank is dead!


I haven't purchased anything beyond CMFS but, have played the demos and the full versions of CMBN at a friends. The issue of LOS the enemy is spotted (Enemy Icon highlighted) still can't shoot it, but the enemy can shoot you, happens all the time but, fan boys always have an excuse! I guess the sun must have been in the gunners eyes! ::)

[Arctic Blast]

Seriously?

Herp a derp derp, haterz
Herp a derp derp to you, fanboyz

IT'S A GAME.



There. You've made me go Charlie Brown...and I HATE CHARLIE BROWN.

[undercovergeek]

Lmao - thanks arctic

[sandman2575]

You hate Charlie Brown??     I didn't think anyone hated Charlie Brown.

This revelation diminishes my faith in humanity, ever so slightly...

[jomni]

Sigh. Any CM thread surely attracts it's staunchest defenders (and opponents). Anyway, just like many of the people in this forums, I too stopped at CMSF.  There is just something missing from the later titles. I can't say what it is. Maybe it's WW2 theme, or the tedious baby sitting of your troops, or it may just be the graphics. I still play CMSF once in a while but I find the experience exhausting after a few missions.

I also forgot that I can't access the BF forums when I clicked the link in the first post. This is because they have subscribed to a spammer repository that wrongly included my IP address. I tried to get help from them but nothing happened. Blanket exclusion of a nice customer like myself leaves very negative impressions.

So I happily moved on without much CM and didn't feel that I missed so much. As someone said, it is just a game anyway.

[Con]

Heh I like how Battlefront is destined to fail because no one plays their games.  They seem to be able to make enough money to do damn well what they please and I would love to be in the F.U money position.  Typically the signs of success in my books being able to say we are going to DRM or what ever we want.  If these things were hurting their bottom line so much then either they would have changed them or folded by now.

I play both games a lot and I like APOS/GTOS having put in countless hours learning the interface but just like CMBN it has its ups and downs.  I particularly find myself coming back to CMBN more for the breadth of gaming individual battles though I like APOS/GTOS for the tactical grand scale.  Mostly I come back to CMBN to play against other humans in PBEM and that is where right now I am particularly happy with continuing to play CMBN.

I think it might be more relevant to wait until more information and screen shots are released by CM East Front before making up an iron clad opinion and telling the world.  But based on the negativity that trying to show anything new seems to endanger in this franchise I wouldn't be surprised if they keep it under wraps until it is ready...........  And then go FU as they count their cash.

Con

[mikeck]

After battling irrational haters over Rome2 and X rebirth (not saying everyone who didn't like them is an irrational hater of course) I am glad that I have no interest in WW2 and no opinion one way or another about CM. I have bought them all and really only play Shockforce. I've been pretty happy with it. The engine is dated but it seems more and more, gaming companies are updating engines to be  more streamlined and simple...so I'm not sure I want a new engine.

Unfortunately, CM and battlefront are - for whatever reason- emotional topics which makes conversation about the game difficult. I PROMISE you that there are people out there (and perhaps on this forum) who have already decided this game sucks and will grasp at any bug or design change in The game to declare it a "mess" or "unplayable"

Meanwhile, I will stick to playing "unplayable" games like rebirth and Rome2 .