Games with Confederate flag being removed from Apple Store

[Sir Slash]

The new Nazi's don't like the old Confederates. The Stars and Stripes will be next.

[fabius]

You have to ask really what the context is? Games "simulating" history is not the same as promoting political ideals. I noticed on another thread that Amazon has followed the same policy, and yet look what they are happy to promote on sale:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mein-Kampf-Adolf-Hitler/dp/817224164X

Does it all not reek of politically correct hypocrisy?

Personally, I think that these companies should not act as censors. I don't even have a problem with them selling Mein Kampf, if anybody wants it. I don't agree with Nazism, but if we lose free expression we go down, slowly but surely into the '1984' police state, which is a state of affairs that the Nazi's would have liked! Why is it that the image of the Confederate flag is considered more heinous than the murderous Nazi and Soviet regimes to these companies?

Far better to have stuff we don't like out there and challenge, or ridicule it, than drive it underground where there is no debate, and no honest criticism.

First up my biases- I am libertarian and believe in equity.

But this censoring games with the confederate flag is nuts. There's plenty of historic people that could take an exception to many flags, Stars and Strips, Union Jack. I will not patronise you people here with historical examples.

[jomni]

Ultimate general has been removed?

[Pete Dero]

I noticed on another thread that Amazon has followed the same policy, and yet look what they are happy to promote on sale:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mein-Kampf-Adolf-Hitler/dp/817224164X

Does it all not reek of politically correct hypocrisy?

Personally, I think that these companies should not act as censors. I don't even have a problem with them selling Mein Kampf, if anybody wants it.

Just received my copy of Military History and found these in the news section :

- Parade Antiques (Plymouth UK) lists a blue service uniform worn by Reichsmarschall Herman Gôring.  Asking price £ 85.000.

- Germany recently approved the re-issue of Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf for the first time in 70 years.  The new edition will be heavily annotated with critical commentary.

[Father Ted]

I don't think this is about political correctness gone mad or censorship, it's about these companies sniffing something on the wind (ie social media) and making a financial decision.

[RyanE]

I can see both sides of this.  The main issue to me is context of how the flag is used or portrayed.  I also think there is some rewriting of history going on in the south...that flag design was not a universal symbol of the south or even its military.  It might behoove some designers to really look and see what flag they should be using anyway.

[JasonPratt]

I don't think this is about political correctness gone mad or censorship, it's about these companies sniffing something on the wind (ie social media) and making a financial decision.

It might also be an attempt to avoid costly though spurious litigation, sad to say; but I agree, this is more a financial decision, though in reaction to a perceived financial threat from PC gone mad.

Although since Amazon isn't a single person making choices on everything, we could easily be seeing PC mad employees interpreting a new company policy in crazy ways. Someone in the other thread, I forget who (sorry), pointed out that Amazon has stopped selling some combat figurines, used in miniature wargaming, which carry a Confederate flag. How this uses "the Confederate flag in offensive or mean-spirited ways", even God probably doesn't know. ;)

[JasonPratt]

Somewhere, an anti-troll has surely just finished posting a note to Amazon about how it sells a fair number of products featuring the ruinous banners of demonic Chaos, and is chortling to himself, "Now we wait..."  >:D

[Greybriar]

From the developers of Ultimate General: Gettysburg: Our game has been removed from AppStore.

I wonder how much my big box Civil War PC games with the cover art displaying the Confederate flag will be worth now?

[Tuna]

I remember when being a modeller seeing a lot of model builders upset that some model companies would remove the swastikas from German Aircraft's rudders. where in reality it was displayed on most.

But I guess the companies couldn't sell in the countries where it was outlawed, so it really was a necessity on their part. Gave a boost for third party decal sets in their luftwaffe lines.

[BanzaiCat]

I'd like to think that most of us (gamers) are rather more enlightened than the average citizen, when it comes to military history and symbology. I can understand these companies making a business decision in this regard, but I in no way support it, and that decision is also in no way, shape, or form considering their target audience - namely, us.

Granted, some games might be aimed towards a more casual gaming crowds, but anyone interested in, say, Civil War: 1862 by Hunted Cow is going to already have a mild interest in the Civil War and therefore more of an understanding than the idiots on television. At least that's my hope, but perhaps I apply too much common sense (or not enough).

What's funny is just a week or so ago I pulled out my copy of American Civil War by Eagle Games, as it's been probably more than 10 years since I even opened the box. Now all this stuff explodes. I'm in the mood to do a War Between the States AAR on this 15-year-old game. :)

[bbmike]

What's funny is just a week or so ago I pulled out my copy of American Civil War by Eagle Games, as it's been probably more than 10 years since I even opened the box. Now all this stuff explodes. I'm in the mood to do a War Between the States AAR on this 15-year-old game. :)

Yes, do it! But you have to use pictures of the game as it progresses. 
And don't worry, I won't mention any of this to the thought police...

[MengJiao]

I'd wager that I'm pretty far to the left of most folks around here, and this move on Apple's part strikes me as arrant stupidity.

Context matters. Context makes all the difference.

  I used to think I was the most Confederate-descended person imaginable.  Then I found out most of my well-known ancestors in Texas were Indians, who spent the Civil War acquiring unsupervised livestock and making moonshine and becoming (secretly) wealthy and building churches.  It was difficult to get to the bottom of their deeds since they have always figured the less said the better.  I'm pretty sure my ancestors would have said, "hmmm" on the topic of Confederate flags or something even more cryptic.

[FarAway Sooner]

I don't think this is about political correctness gone mad or censorship, it's about these companies sniffing something on the wind (ie social media) and making a financial decision.

I think Father Ted highlights a subtle but profound issue here.  When many of you talk about censorship, you seem to be implicitly talking about political censorship.  Apple's move is purely profit-motivated, as they figure that they are likely to piss off a larger customer base by retaining the title than by removing it.

I don't agree with the decision as relates to UG: Gettysburg, but it's not like the government had any role here.  Social censorship is an issue, but let's just be really certain not to confuse the two when we use the word "censorship".

[RyanE]

That is a great distinction.  In Germany, the nazi flag thing is government censorship (and possibly rightly so).  Here its peer/business pressure.