Civ V - Gods and Kings Pre-Order

[bayonetbrant]

...
The change I didn't like in G&K is where the gifted units appear.  In the original Civ V, they appeared at the city-state.  In G&K, they appear in your territory.  It used to be you could meet a new city-state with a naval unit, bribe them to become allies, and let them spawn 2-3 units for you on the new continent, and it's fewer that you have to ship across the ocean - especially useful if you haven't discovered optics yet and can't embark land units.

Yeah I was a bit miffed by this as well, but I think it's better for the game. No free explorers on other continents.

Yes, but back to the original scenario: we haven't discovered optics yet - and city-state science frequently lags behind main players - so we can't embark land units over water.  My ship sails up and says "hi there, we'd like to rent your city as an ally for a few years" and drops a boatload of gold on them then sails off.

2 years later, my 'ally' decides I'm worthy of the gift of a unit, and instead of raising it at their city-state, where (presumably) it was recruited from the ranks of their peeps, it's magically teleported back to my realm.

Now I kinda-sorta understand the game-balance issue, but it's counter-intuitive that they would raise a unit in my backyard.  If they're 'paying' for me to raise the unit, why didn't I just buy it myself?  If they're magically transporting it back to my land, I want access to that tech.

But if I'm buying the allegiance of a military city-state - especially if it's adjacent to someone that I'm at war with on another continent - I better damn well get the unit in that city-state where it can be thrown into the front.  When the Romanians were throwing units into the German invasion of Russian in 1942, they weren't routing them through Berlin ferchrissakes!

[Barthheart]

 ;D

Yeah I see yer point.

[Gusington]

I have been besieging the city state of Lhasa for a number of turns and they are a tough nut to crack. The year is ~1425 so I am still using archers and catapults. I have taken losses and the war is becoming a bit...costly...so, is it worth it in the end to finally take said city?

I went to war with Lhasa because they were becoming a pain in my keister, asking for artists and material support almost every turn. They have no allies (probably because they are so annoying) so I decided to shut them up proper.

I have ringed the city with archers and have sent a couple of ships to bombard them from the water. But it is costing me.

[Barthheart]

Do you really need to conquer them? I almost never take out city-states they are in the direct path of my expansion. Will you gain anything worthwhile? Strategic or luxury resources?

If yes then keep at it. You will need 3 or 4 archers or 2 or 3 catapults or combination and some melee units like swordsmen, maybe 2 or 3.

Place melee units right up against the city and then bombard the city with yer ranged units. When the city's health bar gets into the low yellow range start attacking with the melee units.

Cities regen about 20+ points of health per turn so you need to do more damage than that to get ahead. If they have a unit inside you have to place for losing at least one of your melee units so have backup ready.

[Gusington]

^It's worth it because it will make me happy and satiate my Civ bloodlust.

[Barthheart]

^It's worth it because it will make me happy and satiate my Civ bloodlust.

Then give'r!

[Gusington]

I have Lhasa ringed...will try to take it tonight. But if every city is like this, how do you guys go about military victory?

[bayonetbrant]

just b/c they keep asking you for stuff doesn't mean they can do anything about it; you have to clear a city-state message ever few turns - big whoop.  Honestly, the ones that seek a great artist or adding furs to your trade network are the best kind of states to have in your orbit b/c your influence goes up with them for doing shit you were probably going to do anyway.

To the point of conquering them - conquering cities is hard work in Civ V b/c of their inherent defense mechanisms.  You *need* melee units to take them down, b/c ranged units can't be the ones to conquer them (tho they can occupy after you do)

Once you conquer them, tho, the work really begins.  Occupation duty isn't easy, and will seriously hit your happiness for a lot of turn until you can smooth over the population - both theirs and yours.

Moreover, if someone unconquers them - kicks you out and "frees" the city, you now have a mortal enemy adjacent to you, with whom you will *never* gain enough influence to overcome the liberator.

Conquering enemy cities is normal.  Conquering city-states shouldn't be the norm, unless there's some vital resource or terrain access you need from the land they're sitting on.  Slapping them just b/c they're annoying is like trying to play whack-a-mole with gender-confused sock-puppet forum trolls: you eventually win, but drive yourself nuts in the meantime.  Better to just ignore them.

[bayonetbrant]

I have Lhasa ringed...will try to take it tonight. But if every city is like this, how do you guys go about military victory?

build bigger armies

[Barthheart]

Haven't tried military victory in Gods & Kings yet. Plus you only need to take each major power's capital for that type of victory, not every city on the map.

Also attack too many city-states and the rest of the city-states will declare war on you en masse.
 

[Gusington]

^HA ok. Well now I'm on a mission to do it :) There are at least two other city states that have actually joined with me to whup ass.

[Barthheart]

Have you come to spies yet?  8)

[Gusington]

^I have and I placed one in...Lhasa. They rigged their election.

[Barthheart]

^I have and I placed one in...Lhasa. They rigged their election.

So you attacked a city-state that your spy was working to bring to your side....... ok..... ???

[Gusington]

Hey man it's my first game! Truth is I sent the spy to Lhasa during my Monday gaming session, then last night I forgot I did that and attacked. Then I got the message that the election was rigged. Oopsie.