Opinions on full-battle Gettysburg games

[Constans]

I had an interesting experience after just finishing my third Guns of Gettysburg game yesterday - it didn't scratch the Gettysburg itch for me.  While it is obviously a very well designed and elegant game, it feels just a bit too abstracted for my taste (I don't get that feeling from its stablemate Napoleon's Triumph, btw).

Any way, I'm looking for something hardcore (e.g. not Gettysburg 150) but not super-granular, and that covers the whole battle.  I took a look at Geek, but there doesn't seem to be anything that is in print that fits that.  Just as an fyi, I owned the first edition of Terrible Swift Sword back in the day, and just sold it recently, but played it so long ago I'm not sure I can comment on it much, apart from it felt pretty epic, but I think it might have been a bit fiddly.

Any recommendations?   

[bob48]

I must admit, TSS is the one that came to mind. I also played it a lot, together with all the other SPI games in the GBotCW series. Other than that, I can't be of much help. I did play some Gettysburg 150 but found it far too simplistic for my tastes.

[Cyrano]

I'm too old skool to recommend anything other than TSS.

I know it''s not the forum for it, but I've long given up (pre-retirement) playing full battles on anything other than the PC.  Tiller's Gettysburg -- MP, mind -- is very good.

[MengJiao]

I'm too old skool to recommend anything other than TSS.

I know it''s not the forum for it, but I've long given up (pre-retirement) playing full battles on anything other than the PC.  Tiller's Gettysburg -- MP, mind -- is very good.

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

[mirth]

I'm too old skool to recommend anything other than TSS.

I know it''s not the forum for it, but I've long given up (pre-retirement) playing full battles on anything other than the PC.  Tiller's Gettysburg -- MP, mind -- is very good.

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

I just ordered Gringo! and Twin Peaks from GMT. If they ever do a reprint of 3 Days of Gettysburg, I'll likely order that too.

[GJK]

Had I the spare cash to pick up a copy AND if I had the table space, then "Last Chance for Victory" (LCV) would be my choice first:  https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/144574/last-chance-victory

I have the sister game of the series ("None but Heroes" covering Antietam/Sharpsburg) (NBH) and very much enjoy the system.


If that was a bit much for you (size, price, scale), then 2nd choice would be one that I have and still very much enjoy, "Thunder at the Crossroads II" (TaTCII).


TaTCII is part of the Civil War Brigade Series (CWBS) and while big and encompassing, it's very manageable in size.  This was the series that is the grandfather of the newer series (Line of Battle (LoB)) used for LCV/NBH.  Very, very similar.  LCV/NBH are regimental level whereas TaTCII is brigade level as mentioned.

If you're familiar with either series, you can skip my description next but if not, then I'll tell you what makes this one unique.  Command and Control is crucial in this series as it was during the battle.  You're either Lee or Meade (larger scenarios or campaign) or a Corps commander for the smaller battles.  Units can't just run around willy-nilly and do as they please; you have to write (yes, write) orders and have them dispatched to the subordinates.  When that order arrives, the commander may a) follow it as written- either right away or after some delay (gotta think about it a bit and kick the troopers around ya know?) or b) follow some variation of your order - maybe they think they know a better way to get there? or c) completely ignore your order (if it wasn't just plain lost).  This makes coordination very tricky!  Lee is better at getting his corps to coordinate but fate can play its hand. 


Combat is very straight forward in both series of games.  In the CWBS, each unit has a loss chart.  As they take losses, their strength dwindles and morale dips.  Combat causes actual losses of men as well as stragglers (which some can be recovered during lulls in the battle).  A large unit may start as an "AA" strength unit that can then "extend lines" into two "A" sized units.  The A unit is the fire level and you cross that on a chart with a few drm's to get the results of hits, stragglers, morale checks/loss, bloodlust (pissed 'em off!) or rout.  The LoB series uses something similar but without loss charts - they have strength point markers that are placed under each unit.  I prefer the loss chart personally but LoB streamlined and cleaned up some of the things that were needed to be done to the CWBS.

The Gamers Archive has all the rules/charts from both the CWBS games as well as the LoB games so you can browse those to get an idea of complexity level and how it plays:  http://www.gamersarchive.net/thegamers/archive/  And yes, there are VASSAL modules for most of these (I did several for the CWBS games) so you could even try them out if you wanted.  They pbem VERY well - and I'd be open for a game should you or someone reading want to try it out.

[bayonetbrant]

I always thought this one looked kind of neat
https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/4048/war-states-gettysburg-1863

And the stacking/facing mechanic is kind of cool - if the unit counter fits in the space, then it's in there, facing the way it faces to fit.
That allows the terrain to factor in:  more complex terrain = smaller spaces;  easier to face open spaces than narrower complex spaces; etc

[bbmike]

I'm too old skool to recommend anything other than TSS.

I know it''s not the forum for it, but I've long given up (pre-retirement) playing full battles on anything other than the PC.  Tiller's Gettysburg -- MP, mind -- is very good.

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

I just ordered Gringo! and Twin Peaks from GMT. If they ever do a reprint of 3 Days of Gettysburg, I'll likely order that too.

I have Pensacola, 1781 from GMT. I think the rules are similar. Fun game! Maybe I'll do an AAR on it after my Don't Tread on Me AAR.

[mirth]

I love you, fellow board game whore.

[Constans]

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

Are you referring to "Three Days of Gettysburg"?  I was leaning towards that too, but it is out of print and very expensive in the resale market.

[bbmike]

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

Are you referring to "Three Days of Gettysburg"?  I was leaning towards that too, but it is out of print and very expensive in the resale market.

This one is not of the Body! Landru! Landru!

[Constans]

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

Are you referring to "Three Days of Gettysburg"?  I was leaning towards that too, but it is out of print and very expensive in the resale market.

This one is not of the Body! Landru! Landru!

Thanks for the recommendation.  Strange name for a Gettysburg game, but I'll check it out. 

[MengJiao]

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

Are you referring to "Three Days of Gettysburg"?  I was leaning towards that too, but it is out of print and very expensive in the resale market.

  Yes, but most of the GRINGO!  Scenarios are more fun and RINGOG! can be spelled by rearranging the letters in GRINGO!  but leaving the exclamation point intact as in the game I'd like to see ACHTUNG!  GRINGO! about the ('fictional') German detachment in the Spanish-American War that was wiped out by the Rough! Riders!

[Constans]

  The GMT Gettysburg looks nice AND you can use roughly the same rules to play GRINGO!

Are you referring to "Three Days of Gettysburg"?  I was leaning towards that too, but it is out of print and very expensive in the resale market.

  Yes, but most of the GRINGO!  Scenarios are more fun and RINGOG! can be spelled by rearranging the letters in GRINGO!  but leaving the exclamation point intact as in the game I'd like to see ACHTUNG!  GRINGO! about the ('fictional') German detachment in the Spanish-American War that was wiped out by the Rough! Riders!

Very insightful.  I haven't tried, but I guess it would also be hard to arrange the letters of Three Days of Gettysburg into the name of a member of the Beatles without significant residue, while Gringo seems much more economical in that regard. 

I think you are quite right in your desire for Achtung! Gringo!, as that is a little-gamed aspect of that conflict. I think Achtung! Chippewa! would also be a useful addition to the series, as the conflict between the Hessian soldiers who settled in Ohio after the War of Independence, and the native American tribes in the area is under gamed, and due a treatment. 

[Nefaro]

I just ordered Gringo! and Twin Peaks from GMT. If they ever do a reprint of 3 Days of Gettysburg, I'll likely order that too.

I picked up Twin Peaks on GMT's Xmas sale.  Have had it on my "to do" stack for punching & clipping. 

My ravenous beast of a corner rounder tool has been poised atop the box, ready to pounce.



Haven't done any of the GBoACW games.  Figured a sale priced title would be a good entry, in addition to featuring two separate and smaller engagements.