Jagged Alliance 3

[Jarhead0331]

...there have been many disappointing reboots over the years, but I have to say, this one looks promising. Keeping my fingers crossed.

[al_infierno]

Looks very promising indeed!  Glad to see they appear to be sticking with Action Points and incremental moving/shooting instead of the Nu Xcom two action points style of things.

[JasonPratt]

Necrothread arise! -- without zombies! -- probably!

Splattercatgaming has posted about 45 minutes worth of gameplay today. PLEASE BE GOOD PLEASE BE GOOD!

[devoncop]

This along with Rogue Trader Warhammer 40K is my only definite purchase of 2023.

Looks delightfully non PC in its 80s characters unlike Baldurs Gate 3 and the suggestive repartee between characters has already upset some of the more "right on" previewers so all good so far 

The combat looks good too with the % to hit chances deliberately not shown unlike XCOM which I really like and the three stances....standing, kneeling and prone, along with aiming or non aimed shots accounting for a lot of combat results.
Line of sight is definitely a thing as is weather  and terrain (don't expect to hit much at range in a rainy tropical jungle)

Really looking forward to both the combat and the overall strategic game.

[SirAndrewD]

Can't wait for this one.  This looks to be a solid blast from the past.  I've wanted to see JA updated to this standard for a long long time. 

[joram]

RPS sure isn't optimistic on it though.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/jagged-alliance-3-desperately-wants-it-to-be-1999-again-and-not-in-a-good-way

[SirAndrewD]

I will say, it's a really bad sign when the previewers, youtubers and forums are all universally saying they'd like an easy to implement feature like chance to hit, and the developers say "No, it's not our vision". 

This isn't an independent art house film, it's an entertainment product.  If the people want chance to hit, give them chance to hit.  Seems like an easy thing to toggle in a hardcore mode, maybe with an achievement attached.

[devoncop]

RPS sure isn't optimistic on it though.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/jagged-alliance-3-desperately-wants-it-to-be-1999-again-and-not-in-a-good-way

RPS reviewer (a big fan of XCOM) is exactly the sort I would expect to dislike the whole vibe of Jagged Alliance 3 because of the hidden % chance to hit mechanic, along with the "progressive" politics of the site itself.

 The dislike of the banter between Mercs because it was insufficiently "right on" seemed to annoy the reviewer so much I put little credence by his conclusions. PC Gamer for what it is worth have done a much more positive preview.

 No issue with RPS having their opinion but as an Owlcat Games fan I am totally okay with no % chance to hit being displayed.

 

 

[W8taminute]

See I'm on the other end of the spectrum.  I loathe chance to hit because what it really means in most xcom type games is chance to miss then get killed by the ai. 

Games that feature always hit but variable damage depending on circumstances is more my style.  It really boils down to what target audience the developer is going for and that's what goes into the game.

Wargaming has influenced me.  When one unit counter attacks another there is always a tangible result.  Even if it is 'no effect'.  At least with a 'no effect' result you don't have to worry about your unit counter immediately dying the next turn due to enemy counter attacks.  (Unless of course it's a mega stack vs. your lone unit)

[SirAndrewD]

I'm actually fine with there being no chance to hit.  I'm just saying I do see the other side of it. 

I do think a decent compromise would be to make it an option since they seem to have a lot of customization in the gameplay.  If it's optional I will almost surely leave it off.

[devoncop]

I'm actually fine with there being no chance to hit.  I'm just saying I do see the other side of it. 

I do think a decent compromise would be to make it an option since they seem to have a lot of customization in the gameplay.  If it's optional I will almost surely leave it off.

Options are almost always the right answer if there is the budget for it.

To refer to Pathfinder again (sorry) it can be played Real Time with Pause or Turn based which solved one of the most divisive arguments within the community over the best approach and in my case brought me into the game as my game reactions roughly equate to that of a retarded sloth so the introduction of a turn based option post release in Kingmaker and from launch with War of the Righteous actually made a huge difference to my purchase decision.

For some folk with Jagged Alliance 3 a displayed graded damage model like that in Panzercorps 2 alongside a concealed straight to hit or miss approach would definitely widen the player base I reckon.

[JasonPratt]

I think any experienced soldier would have a reasonably educated guess what the hit chances are with a weapon under a current condition, so I'd rather see SOMETHING on feedback, even if it's not an explicit percent chance. No doubt after a thousand hours playing the game I could personally expect what the various chances would be for various characters with their (possibly various and varying) skills, using various weapons at various levels of experience (perhaps varying with various skills) under various conditions, but not in the first hour of playing the game. Or even the 20th hour, especially if their proficiencies change.

Having nothing wouldn't be a total dealbreaker for me. But I'd be hoping for a modder at least.

[SirAndrewD]

The game does have feedback on ideal weapon range and stats for the individual soldier's marksmanship.  That's decent enough to make an educated guess.

Maybe they should add a tiny but of dialogue feedback.  Aim for an insane difficult shot and maybe the Merc mutters to himself "Gonna need a lucky shot" or somesuch. 

[devoncop]

The game does have feedback on ideal weapon range and stats for the individual soldier's marksmanship.  That's decent enough to make an educated guess.

Maybe they should add a tiny but of dialogue feedback.  Aim for an insane difficult shot and maybe the Merc mutters to himself "Gonna need a lucky shot" or somesuch. 

Good suggestion. I like that

[joram]

I watched Splattercats video and even he said it's weird not to have it.  And they give you so much information otherwise, it just seems weird.  I can see myself being frustrated with it.

But perhaps the issue isn't whether they have it or not but rather the schizophrenic nature of the info provided.    If they just consolidated all the info into a qualitative system ("poor", "fair", "good") that varied by weapon range, AP, cover, etc, that may be a better experience than telling you everything but the ultimate to hit chance.   They just need to choose one direction or another here or I can see a lot of frustration with it.