Pike and Shot

[panzerde]

Pike and Shot Patched.
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=299&t=54371&sid=3e77aeffa5250cd16862af215b3e06c8

But there's a problem with the non-Steam  installer.  Steam is fine.

Some nice fixes and additions. I'm most interested in the idea of being able to set up PBEM games with custom points. I just picked up All is Lost Save Honour and might look at P&S as an alternative means of resolving the tactical combat.

[PipFromSlitherine]

Looks like I stumbled into a limitation in the editor. You can only make use of a limited number of skins per 3d model.  My mod shares the same 3d models of the different generals. So my dreams of having several generals with their own banners in a single battle are shattered.

I'm stumped! Whatever I do from now will just be for skirmish. :/

I've increased the number of possible texture sets and so that will be in a future patch.

Cheers

Pip

[jomni]

Looks like I stumbled into a limitation in the editor. You can only make use of a limited number of skins per 3d model.  My mod shares the same 3d models of the different generals. So my dreams of having several generals with their own banners in a single battle are shattered.

I'm stumped! Whatever I do from now will just be for skirmish. :/

I've increased the number of possible texture sets and so that will be in a future patch.

Cheers

Pip

Great news.

[Boggit]

Looks like they've put in some useful changes. :)

[jomni]

Unit portraits replaced.   O0

[panzerde]

The lack of leaders in this game is really a problem. Command and leadership were such a big deal in the era and I'm really feeling the lack of leader units. The melee, rout, and pursuit mechanics are very period. Adding leaders and some simple command rules would really make a difference in this game.

[jomni]

The lack of leaders in this game is really a problem. Command and leadership were such a big deal in the era and I'm really feeling the lack of leader units. The melee, rout, and pursuit mechanics are very period. Adding leaders and some simple command rules would really make a difference in this game.

I asked for leaders in the Slitherine forums and how to actually code them.  It seems pretty logical that one can implement bonuses to units within the leaders radius, gets more movement points, combat bonus etc.  It may possible though complicated but I did not dig deeper.  Why?  Because I realized the AI will not be using the leaders as they should when implemented.  These things should be a native implementation rather than a mod.

[panzerde]

I asked for leaders in the Slitherine forums and how to actually code them.  It seems pretty logical that one can implement bonuses to units within the leaders radius, gets more movement points, combat bonus etc.  It may possible though complicated but I did not dig deeper.  Why?  Because I realized the AI will not be using the leaders as they should when implemented.  These things should be a native implementation rather than a mod.

+1 to this. I understand the desire to have a simple game to increase the appeal, but let's face it, a game that covers pike and shot warfare is never going to be "mainstream" even if you define mainstream as "people who will play a simple WW2 game." The lack of things like leaders and their accompanying formations makes P&S ultimately a bit shallow in terms of replay value.


I've completely given up on the historical battles, for example. There really is no point in trying to simulate Breitenfeld or Lutzen or White Mountain without leadership effects. Several of these battles completely revolved around the army leadership. Trying to simulate them without it isn't a historical scenario, it's just plopping some generic units on a map that vaguely resembles the field in question, and smashing them together.


The redeeming aspect of P&S IMO is the skirmish engine. That's a nice laboratory for trying out different army compositions against each other. From that perspective I guess it shows it's FOG roots - FOG is much the same way regarding historical versus skirmish battles. FOG has leaders, though.

[PipFromSlitherine]

The lack of leaders in this game is really a problem. Command and leadership were such a big deal in the era and I'm really feeling the lack of leader units. The melee, rout, and pursuit mechanics are very period. Adding leaders and some simple command rules would really make a difference in this game.

I asked for leaders in the Slitherine forums and how to actually code them.  It seems pretty logical that one can implement bonuses to units within the leaders radius, gets more movement points, combat bonus etc.  It may possible though complicated but I did not dig deeper.  Why?  Because I realized the AI will not be using the leaders as they should when implemented.  These things should be a native implementation rather than a mod.

I know Richard and Iain had their reasons for not including leaders, but just to note that you can also custom script the AI in any campaign, and so that is no impediment to implementing leaders in a mod :)

Cheers

Pip

[jomni]

Working on Japanese terrain.  Only works in the editor.  Skirmish mode will always randomly generate a map using the original Central Europe scenery. 

[jomni]

New patch.  They're addressing one of the limitations in my modding which is using and modding the Ramdom Map generation script.

[Zulu1966]

The lack of leaders in this game is really a problem. Command and leadership were such a big deal in the era and I'm really feeling the lack of leader units. The melee, rout, and pursuit mechanics are very period. Adding leaders and some simple command rules would really make a difference in this game.

I asked for leaders in the Slitherine forums and how to actually code them.  It seems pretty logical that one can implement bonuses to units within the leaders radius, gets more movement points, combat bonus etc.  It may possible though complicated but I did not dig deeper.  Why?  Because I realized the AI will not be using the leaders as they should when implemented.  These things should be a native implementation rather than a mod.

I know Richard and Iain had their reasons for not including leaders, but just to note that you can also custom script the AI in any campaign, and so that is no impediment to implementing leaders in a mod :)

Cheers

Pip

It would be nice to know their reasons as it is a bizarre and in my opinion poor decision that every time I fire it up completely kills my interest. Dumbing down a game with this subject matter is well, just dumb.

[Nefaro]

I didn't even take notice of a need for leadership.  I didn't expect it to be The Great Battles series or anything. *shrug*

[jomni]

I didn't even take notice of a need for leadership.  I didn't expect it to be The Great Battles series or anything. *shrug*

Well it's based on FOG and FOG has leaders.

[Cyrano]

It's the bit that Jomni mentions that really puzzles me.  I'll admit to always having been a DBR for this period (or a DBA extension when I was getting lazy), but this is built far more like FOG:R than FOG:A was and it's a noticeable omission for that reason.

Breitenfeld and Lutzen aren't quite the same for me without Gustavus and the less said about certain ECW battles without Cromwell and Fairfax the better.

Don't get me wrong, I'm quite grateful to have a good game in this niche of niches, but I hope it's successful enough for them to consider taking a swipe at leaders down the road.

Best,

Jim
"Cyrano"
:/7)