Sovereignty: Crown of Kings enters Early Access

[-budd-]

it looks thin, but i might be one of the ones pigeon holing it into the 4X category where there is so much to do every turn. I defiantly like the look of it, looks like the basics are there and that early access it going to be a good thing for this game. i'll be eager to hear from players when there deeper into the game or manage to finish a game. I imagine i'll jump into the early access just not right now.

[tgb]

The early game can be slow going, especially if you are playing one of the smaller, weaker factions.  It's kind of like the way Crusader Kings II made you think that starting with a small realm in order to learn the mechanics would be easier, when in fact it's tougher because you can't do a lot.

[MetalDog]

I'm liking the little bit I've played.  I watched the first Let's Play and done the tutorial.  Going to start a fresh game later today.

[mikeck]

Here's the thing about province upgrades, building and the like  this is NOT a 4X game.  If you go into it looking for one, you will be disappointed.  It's first and foremost a war game, with basic diplomacy and province management.  It has more in common with Birthright, Fantasy General, Fantasy Empires, and even Warlords that it does with Master of Magic or Heroes of Might and Magic.

And to the poster who said that it can't be deep if you don't build buildings - how much province development is there in Grigsby's games?  Just because a game doesn't have a feature you wish it did doesn't make it shallow.

Ok, well that was me and I disagree. Grigsby's games are FAR MORE in depth concerning armies. In thos game there are no supply issues, assigning commanders (just 1 hero per army), flanking bonuses, terrain issues, etc

You can't possibly compare the military strategy in this game to Grigsby's

That said, it's not supposed to be. BUT, I do think the lack of any province improvement other than "improve" limits the game as there is simply not enough depth in the military game for me

Key point...FOR ME. Others may like it. It is early release after all and i want to like it. I just don't see any depth yet

You are raising a straw man argument.  I never said Sovereignty had as much depth in the combat system as one of GG's games.  I used GG's games as an example of games that don't have province development but are still deep.

It's not a strawman argument. My point was though those games don't have development, they are wargames and their depth comes in the strategic and tactical areas. This game seems to have neither.... that's my point. If you aren't going to have problems development then maybe we should have more depth in the trading or tactical battles?

I did read somewhere that they were going to add elements to the province development though.

It may end up being a great game and may be  now for some people already. It's early access that's what this time is for. But after about 10 times I just kind of stopped and said "so this is it "?

If there's one thing we all know it's that some of us like games that other ones don't like. So I'm not saying that the game sucks or no One should get it.
I'm just saying that I really really want to like this game and was hoping for just a little more depth

[Rayfer]

The map reminds me of the Dominion series. Is this game anything like them?

[tgb]

The map reminds me of the Dominion series. Is this game anything like them?

No.  Just the opposite, in fact.  Dominions is all about realm management, researching, and throwing a lot of spells around, with hands-off combat.  Sovereignty is all about tactical combat, with almost no realm management, no research, and very little magic

[mikeck]

It has a beautiful map. One of the best I've seen in this type of game

[panzerde]

Bought it on the strength of the videos, and so far have played the tutorial. Clearly early access, but enjoyable. This could end up being very good.

[MetalDog]

I chose Sonneneve.  Always been a sucker for Elves.  Tolkien Elves, not those mincing, prancing, faux-mystical imitations just about everyone else has.  I have non-aggression pacts with Aevinwode (the Neutral faction of Elves) and Sirucil (the Evil faction of Elves).  I am attempting to build up my army to take three provinces from my Human neighbor.  In two of the provinces, there are Resources.  One has Iron the other has Gems.  Nothing in my army requires Gems, but, I can definitely use the Iron.  And Gems are a valuable trade good.  i am also stockpiling Resources each turn.  Opens more options for trade.

[Martok]

I chose Sonneneve.  Always been a sucker for Elves.  Tolkien Elves, not those mincing, prancing, faux-mystical imitations just about everyone else has.  I have non-aggression pacts with Aevinwode (the Neutral faction of Elves) and Sirucil (the Evil faction of Elves).  I am attempting to build up my army to take three provinces from my Human neighbor.  In two of the provinces, there are Resources.  One has Iron the other has Gems.  Nothing in my army requires Gems, but, I can definitely use the Iron.  And Gems are a valuable trade good.  i am also stockpiling Resources each turn.  Opens more options for trade.

Is that Cragenwaste you're going after? 

[MetalDog]

It is, Martok.  They don't have some secret weapon I should be afraid of...do they?

[Ian C]

As far as depth, it's deeper than Commander: The Great War, and this game is not a 4x game, but indeed more like Commander.

As for the function of each province's economy level:

Each province has an economy rating (0 to 8 or more). You can improve it by paying a sum of gold, which increases with the level of upgrade. The improved rating nets more income per turn, but there is a maximum rating for each province (you just can't improve all of them to 9 etc). Some of them cap-out at lower levels based on some internal factor. Also, the distance away from your capitol also reduces efficiency of income for distant provinces.

The economy rank of each province is reduced by 1 per turn of occupation. When it reaches zero, the province is captured, so it pays to upgrade them for economic and defensive purposes.


I'm several years in, as Ariselle, the great northern Island naval power (Great Britain clone) and have fought a war against Jotland (Norse clone).
I happily occupied the rest of Jotland before the great powers of the south started making inroads in my northern sphere, so that pissed me off and I decided to annex the whole of Jotland, to bump my rank to just under 'Great Power' status.

So I took over the final capitol province, which was a war of attrition (the Jotlanders are by no means a pushover) angering all the civilized nations.
My diplomatic relations with everyone else are around -30 or more (Hostile) so I can live with that, as long as no one decides to go to war against me. There are powerful alliances around me but my navy is a juggernaut. I'll sit it out for a few years and use diplomacy. However, Palemoor (the undead lands) just cast a global spell of permanent Winter over the world, so I'm guessing that only way to fix things is to conquer them.

[MetalDog]

Cragenwaste made it easy on me and declared war before I could.  I happily obliged him by taking the battle to the first province I had my eye on.  I fought a tactical battle instead of auto resolve.  May have made the difference as I couldn't eliminate all the units of his army before the allotted time was up.  Instead, I captured a second victory hex to seal the win.  Having seen what Khazoth, the evil Orc Kingdom directly on the other side of the province I have captured, has for an army, I may have bitten off more than I can chew.  DAMN those are some bad ass looking Orcs!

[Martok]

It is, Martok.  They don't have some secret weapon I should be afraid of...do they?

Ha.  No, not as far as I'm aware of.  I just know from my experience in the beta that they like to go after Sonneneve a lot -- often with devastating results (the poor High Elves seem to always get their asses kicked back to their capital) -- so I thought your bringing the fight to them was a bit of poetic justice.  ;) 

Cragenwaste made it easy on me and declared war before I could.  I happily obliged him by taking the battle to the first province I had my eye on.  I fought a tactical battle instead of auto resolve.  May have made the difference as I couldn't eliminate all the units of his army before the allotted time was up.  Instead, I captured a second victory hex to seal the win.  Having seen what Khazoth, the evil Orc Kingdom directly on the other side of the province I have captured, has for an army, I may have bitten off more than I can chew.  DAMN those are some bad ass looking Orcs!

Try to make common cause with the Dwarves of Brogen Hur, perhaps?  (They were my favorite faction in the beta. O0 )  Khazoth was usually my favorite target (and most frequent enemy) when playing as them, which I suspect was kinda/sorta on purpose on the part of the devs. 

[tgb]

The developers are saying they are looking into adding some 4X elements like buildings.  I hope they don't, as it will divert resources from where they are most needed (AI) and turn this from a good war game into a mediocre one that is neither fish nor fowl.