Warlock Released

[Marty Ward]

is the fire elemental currently kicking my ass a random free roaming apparition (tm) or does it belong to someone - cos its causing me quite a bit of trouble!!

Here are a few of his 'family' members!

[Nefaro]

The "Greater Fire  Elementals" are even more fun.  :)

[FarAway Sooner]

OK, I finally found this place (I wondered where all you guys had gone--thanks, Brant!!) and figured I'd make my first post in this thread!!

So, I downloaded the demo and was very impressed by the "one more turn" sensation I got.  Awesome.  But, after having played the demo a few times, I'm a little concerned about the replay value with only 3 factions.  I've seen some comments much earlier upthread but, now that people have been playing a little longer, I wanted to ask a few general questions as I try to decide whether to buy or just keep playing SWTOR for now:

• Are there significant differences in the different types of mages?  Can we pick different spell type specializations, a la the "spell books" in MoM, or do most all mages play pretty much alike?  I enjoyed only having access to one or two schools of magic in the old MoM, as it created real gaps in my tactical abilities that had to be managed around.
• Given only three factions, and a few special terrain features to spice up unit availability (e.g., Dwarven Villages, Halberd Tents, etc.), does the game suffer from each faction having one really optimal "build path" and not much point in playing a faction differently?
• Do different maps really drive different playing styles?  And do all the gateways to other worlds get used much in the later game?  Or is it easier to just focus on crushing the mages on your home planet?
• I know there are 4 ways to win or lose the game, but do you use different ways in different games?  And does the AI ever beat you using different ways, or is it pretty much always the conquest route?

Any thoughts would be much appreciated!

[Nefaro]

I've not even bothered going to other planes yet, as crushing the enemy mages seems more a priority.

Each game start is a bit different in that the spells you start with are random, although purchasing starter ones is available.  The rest of the randomness (start location, etc) doesn't provide a big variety in gameplay, though.  The mages are quite different at start, however, because they all have completely different buildings/races (and therefore units) of their own to start the game with.  They can mostly choose from all the same starter perks, though.

I've not played a good enough sampling of games (nor all of the difficulty levels) yet.  So I dunno how much of a long-term challenge this will be.  While the AI seems to be able to make some good decisions, it also loses some opportunities.   The main difficulty I get from the AI is when they all start dogpiling me with wardecs so I suppose the biggest challenge is fighting against the AI zerg as it eventually builds up.  You're probably even better off just keeping your exploration to a minimum, in order to delay the inevitable bribery demands that will be put on you from all those enemies you've discovered.   In this way the Diplomacy with the AI is terribly simple, and resembles Hegemony Gold's "Bribe Us Or Die!" single-purpose Diplo model, which is it's biggest weakness IMO.

The build paths are generally of two lines:  the line that improves your basic units: archers and melee, and provides and upgrade option to them.  The other is for your special, higher cost but more powerful race units.   There is a third more magical line for your Mage-ish unit(s), now that I think of it.  And also one for your ships - of which I know the Undead have some unusual versions.   You often want to mix & match some because one fun part about the combat is all the damage types modelled which gives each unit differing strengths & weaknesses.  So it's not like some crappy RTS'es and their single build order IWIN "strategies".

I've only ever conquered in my games, but that's just the more straightforward, obvious way.   I didn't even know there were three others... only the Research victory and..?  Max'd out three Gods or something?  The latter is just too difficult/time-consuming to accomplish that I've seen in my games, compared to other routes.

As I've said before, the gameplay is closer to a Fantasy (Panzer) General with some basic grand strategy added in, than the Civ game the interface so much resembles.  Because this game is very much focused on combat and advancing your various combat units' experience levels (with an fun variety of units). 

[LongBlade]

OK, I finally found this place (I wondered where all you guys had gone--thanks, Brant!!) and figured I'd make my first post in this thread!!

So, I downloaded the demo and was very impressed by the "one more turn" sensation I got.  Awesome.  But, after having played the demo a few times, I'm a little concerned about the replay value with only 3 factions.  I've seen some comments much earlier upthread but, now that people have been playing a little longer, I wanted to ask a few general questions as I try to decide whether to buy or just keep playing SWTOR for now:

• Are there significant differences in the different types of mages?  Can we pick different spell type specializations, a la the "spell books" in MoM, or do most all mages play pretty much alike?  I enjoyed only having access to one or two schools of magic in the old MoM, as it created real gaps in my tactical abilities that had to be managed around.
• Given only three factions, and a few special terrain features to spice up unit availability (e.g., Dwarven Villages, Halberd Tents, etc.), does the game suffer from each faction having one really optimal "build path" and not much point in playing a faction differently?
• Do different maps really drive different playing styles?  And do all the gateways to other worlds get used much in the later game?  Or is it easier to just focus on crushing the mages on your home planet?
• I know there are 4 ways to win or lose the game, but do you use different ways in different games?  And does the AI ever beat you using different ways, or is it pretty much always the conquest route?

Any thoughts would be much appreciated!

Heya FarAway. Welcome!

There are a number of different mages with different abilities and you can customize your abilities/perks, too.

There are slightly different play styles on different maps - I played the island map and it's much more challenging than an all-land map.

The AI isn't very bright but on harder difficulty levels it will gang up on you and the game will be much more challenging.

[Marty Ward]

I've not even bothered going to other planes yet, as crushing the enemy mages seems more a priority.

I tried to post a screen shot of an other world. They are brutal when you first enter. The manual says you might find an empty one, don't count on it. They are extremely tough to clear, I don't see how anyone could do it if they put in MP. It requires a fair number of high level units just to survive a visit much less clear one out enough to build a city there to get some of the more special items, like dragon eggs.

[Capn Darwin]

So far I've had no real urge to take them over. I need my high value units on map either repelling other mages or crushing them into dust. If I find a portal I'll send in low cost fast moving units to recon for lootable locations. I'll use the fast units to grab what I can or draw off the bad guys and then cast in imps or other low cost summons that I can drop at the edge of the LOS of the other units to aid in recon or looting.  8)

[Marty Ward]

So far I've had no real urge to take them over. I need my high value units on map either repelling other mages or crushing them into dust. If I find a portal I'll send in low cost fast moving units to recon for lootable locations. I'll use the fast units to grab what I can or draw off the bad guys and then cast in imps or other low cost summons that I can drop at the edge of the LOS of the other units to aid in recon or looting.  8)

Let me know how that works out  :)

[FarAway Sooner]

Well, I took the plunge and ordered it on Steam just now and am downloading!  If the "one more turn" phenomenon from the demo is an accurate projection of what the full game is going to play like, I'm in for a world of hurt and bleary-eyed mornings...  :D

35%...  36%...

[LongBlade]

Well, I took the plunge and ordered it on Steam just now and am downloading!  If the "one more turn" phenomenon from the demo is an accurate projection of what the full game is going to play like, I'm in for a world of hurt and bleary-eyed mornings...  :D

35%...  36%...

Nice seeing ya on the boards. Let us know when you come back up for air!

[FarAway Sooner]

Good to be here, LB.  But I've got a 2-year old.  It's more about when I get to jump into the pool for a little while!!  :D

[steve58]

Looks like patch 1.2 is due out this week:

Patch Notes 1.2 - Patch is waiting for multilingual translation and should be uploaded to Steam this week.

Multiplayer and Diplomacy
• Players can now play Multiplayer games! (Steam is required).
• New Diplomacy system in Multiplayer and Single play: Now when a player sends a proposal to rival Mage it will be delivered on the beginning of his/her turn. You will receive an answer on your subsequent turn. The Diplomacy Screen was modified accordingly. Also a player will never know for sure if his\her proposal would or would not be accepted - there will be seen only a prediction of it before the message is sent.

"Lords and Artifacts"
• Mighty Lords come to your service! They can learn faster than normal units and receive many powerful abilities as they progress through level-ups. You can hire these heroes as they come occasionally searching for job, find them in monster layers or even receive them as quest reward.
• Lords can use powerful Artifacts which could be found in monster dens, received as quests rewards, gained and lost during battles, bought from Trader of Artifacts or smelted to mana.

Bug Fixes and Improvements
• A player may turn on/off Victory Conditions on the Game Start.
• Mages, Veterans and Halberdies got new skills. Mages can learn to cast fireballs and Veterans now have ZoneOfControl perk.
• Implemented a News message when you successfully research a new spell.
• Implemented a News message when any of the Great Mages controls a certain percentage of Holy Grounds.
• The Unity Spell cannot be counterspelled anymore, but its casting time was made longer. Also starting to cast a Unity spell worsens relations with all Great Mages.
• A Message "A Great Mage is Defeated" now looks better.
• AI now uses Dispels smarter and more aggressively.
• Teleportation spells casting interface logic is more intuitive: now you can select a spell, then a target unit, and then a hex to move.
• Fixed an issue: an enchantment cast on a unit in transport ship is now shown properly on unit when it disembarks.
• Game loading has become faster.
• Great Mages now think 10-15% faster.
• Settlers do not receive experience points any more.
• Fixed an issue when a player could remove a "self-destruct" perk from units summoned by other units.
• Fixed a crash on clicking on a News message about a new unit if the city was destroyed.
• Fixed an issue with the unit's experience when a unit is upgraded twice the same turn.
• Fixed an issue with game camera position at the game start.
• Fixed an issue when unit movement points and "cooldown" timers could be higher than their current maximum.
• Fixed some issues with duplicating perks.
• Fixed a rare crash when a player disbands his unit.

[TheCommandTent]

Awesome news.  Multiplayer!!

[Nefaro]

That's a pretty big patch!

Not only adding multi-player but more unit types?  I'd be a bit concerned about those hero units further making the player's job easier.  Unless they somehow managed to shoehorn in code for the AI to utilize them fairly well, too.  It already sounded like a lot of work, though. 

I hope they have multi-player stable.



Sproing!

[Barthheart]

Yeah we'll have to give MP a spin.....  8)