School shooting in Florida

[bbmike]

:DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD

http://wncn.com/2018/02/26/trump-says-he-would-have-confronted-florida-shooter/

Not really as funny as when you read another source on this. And it highlights how information is skewed to fit someone's narrative. This is why I get news from multiple sources.

From the article:

"I really believe I'd run in there even if I didn't have a weapon," the president told a group of state governors gathered at the White House.
Mr Trump also said it was "disgusting" that officers reportedly did not confront the suspect on 14 February.
The massacre was the second-deadliest shooting at a US school.
"I think most of the people in this room would have done that, too," said the US president on Monday of his assertion that he would have rushed into the school.
He added: "You never know until you're tested."

It's not really about the source or the full text. It's just that anyone who said that or something similar as to how they think they would have reacted in similar circumstances would naturally be perceived as a dick. Trump is a dick but if Mickey mouse had said that I would have thought him a dick.

Personally I think most people in that room would not have done that. Trump most especially not. It takes a special breed of man/woman to run towards gunfire armed or not and I doubt outside of his secret service agents there were many in the room who were of that ilk.

Yes, it is about the source and the LACK of full text when what's being reported doesn't include the whole story. I 100% agree with you that most people, especially Trump, would not run towards gunfire. I get it that Mickey Mouse would make a better President. But if you actually watched and listened to what Trump said you would see that even he questioned himself. Even the part I bolded from BBC wasn't correct. He didn't 'add' that line, he said it along with the "I believe I would have..." line. People want to stick their heads in the sand but there really is media bias all across the board. It's this kind of reporting that leads to charges of fake news.

[OJsDad]

I very much doubt it would be public knowledge as to which teachers or admins were armed or not, so I'm not sure how your scenario would unfold.

...has it been a while since you were in school? ;) Because, regardless of the pros and cons of arming teachers/staff, scuttlebutt would congregate pretty quickly around who was armed, especially if there are official certification and training upkeep requirements. Some of that might be educated guesses (and so mistaken, right or wrong in either direction), but kids (and parents) WOULD be working out who was armed.

So I wouldn't base any strategy on the armed staff being unknown to shooters who are students at the school, or who are connected to students. Randos off the street, sure; but not students.

Who is armed is not public information.  In other words, along with other safety plans and policies, a person from the general public or the media can demand to see it.  That won't stop people from guessing, but they will not learn about it from any records kept.

We had our school board meeting last night.  This was of course discussed.

1.  We have a part time School Resource Officer.  He, along with some other deputies that live in the district have made 180's on arming staff.  They've gone from opposing to believing that we should.

2.  We recieved a packet last night, explain laws on allowing staff to be armed, a letter from the state AG green lighting the arming of staff, differences in training for concealed carry vs law enforcement training, and lot of other common questions answered.

3.  We have first aid kits at school, but we're looking at getting a trauma kit also.  We have a local ambulance service, but it's an on call service.  Meaning the EMT's are not at the station.  The nearest full time ambulance is at 10 mins away. 

4.  Door blocking devices are being installed on every interior door in every school in the county, public and parochial.  These devices can with stand 16,000 psi.  Our students and staff and being trained that, during a lock down, if the fire alarm goes off, they are to stay put with the door secure, unless there is an actual fire or smoke in the room they're in. 

[Gusington]

Embarrassed about all this? No. It's a horrible situation. And I personally don't hide my kids from it, although I want to sometimes. I talk to them as best I can about it, apologize for the world being so f'd up, and we keep calm, carry on, and have a stiff upper lip about it all. I also tell them that the news is designed to make them scared and to use their brains and that they have a better chance of getting struck by lightning than getting shot in a school massacre.

That doesn't mean that this whole thing does not make me want to vomit, every day. But I don't show the kids that.

MICKEY 2020

[bayonetbrant]

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http://wncn.com/2018/02/26/trump-says-he-would-have-confronted-florida-shooter/

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https://www.duffelblog.com/2018/02/trump-awards-self-medal-honor-hypothetically-saving-everyone-school-shooting/

[mirth]

gotta love TDB

[Pete Dero]

Florida school shooting: Officer Scot Peterson defends actions

Broward Sheriff's Office had trained him to seek cover and assess the situation in the event of outdoor gunfire, his lawyer said.
Mr Peterson did so, and then told the sheriff's office he had heard shots, prompting a "Code Red" lockdown of the school campus.

When police arrived, he told them he thought the gunman was outside - a belief backed up by "radio transmissions [which] indicated that there was a gunshot victim in the area of the football field," Mr Peterson said, according to his lawyer.

[Zulu1966]

:DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD :DD

http://wncn.com/2018/02/26/trump-says-he-would-have-confronted-florida-shooter/

Not really as funny as when you read another source on this. And it highlights how information is skewed to fit someone's narrative. This is why I get news from multiple sources.

From the article:

"I really believe I'd run in there even if I didn't have a weapon," the president told a group of state governors gathered at the White House.
Mr Trump also said it was "disgusting" that officers reportedly did not confront the suspect on 14 February.
The massacre was the second-deadliest shooting at a US school.
"I think most of the people in this room would have done that, too," said the US president on Monday of his assertion that he would have rushed into the school.
He added: "You never know until you're tested."

It's not really about the source or the full text. It's just that anyone who said that or something similar as to how they think they would have reacted in similar circumstances would naturally be perceived as a dick. Trump is a dick but if Mickey mouse had said that I would have thought him a dick.

Personally I think most people in that room would not have done that. Trump most especially not. It takes a special breed of man/woman to run towards gunfire armed or not and I doubt outside of his secret service agents there were many in the room who were of that ilk.

Yes, it is about the source and the LACK of full text when what's being reported doesn't include the whole story. I 100% agree with you that most people, especially Trump, would not run towards gunfire. I get it that Mickey Mouse would make a better President. But if you actually watched and listened to what Trump said you would see that even he questioned himself. Even the part I bolded from BBC wasn't correct. He didn't 'add' that line, he said it along with the "I believe I would have..." line. People want to stick their heads in the sand but there really is media bias all across the board. It's this kind of reporting that leads to charges of fake news.

Yes. And I take your point, but what I don't take is the.contention that this kind of thing somehow only started with trump. Which seems to be his contention if not yours. I think half the issue with trump is that he is so palpably a dick  even outside of his politics that those who don't like him actually hate him. He is also more than guilty of contributing to the whole fake news thing as much as he is sometimes a subject of ... if not completely fake tailored to show him in a bad light.

My point was about this particular thing is that personally I would steer away from painting myself as a hero in the absence of any realistic prospect of me ever being in a position of proving it.. whether or not I included other people in that assertion. Regardless of the full text of what he said I just think it's something you don't do. Much as I wouldn't comment on whether something a soldier in Iraq did or didn't do it's just bad form yo put yourself there and say you would have acted with more courage than someone else.

It's not really connected to him being president or fake news just an example of the high opinion he has of himself and how he is arrogant enough to say it.

I didn't mean Mickey mouse in the context of president more in relation to any Joe soap saying it would have the same opinion of him.

[airboy]

Florida school shooting: Officer Scot Peterson defends actions

Broward Sheriff's Office had trained him to seek cover and assess the situation in the event of outdoor gunfire, his lawyer said.
Mr Peterson did so, and then told the sheriff's office he had heard shots, prompting a "Code Red" lockdown of the school campus.

When police arrived, he told them he thought the gunman was outside - a belief backed up by "radio transmissions [which] indicated that there was a gunshot victim in the area of the football field," Mr Peterson said, according to his lawyer.

This was said through his lawyer.  Funny how he would not be interviewed by anyone plus he resigned.

According to reports when a nearby city's cops arrived there were 4 Broward County deputies outside the building.

[airboy]

I hated it when Obama would interject himself into local police matters - which he did with incendiary effect multiple times during his time in office.

I also hate it when Trump does it, but there is no incendiary effect because it does not rile up tensions because he is so unbelievable.

[bayonetbrant]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/we-studied-thousands-of-anonymous-posts-about-the-parkland-attack---and-found-a-conspiracy-in-the-making/2018/02/27/04a856be-1b20-11e8-b2d9-08e748f892c0_story.html?utm_term=.b91577df0dfc

Forty-seven minutes after news broke of a high school shooting in Parkland, Fla., the posters on the anonymous chat board 8chan had devised a plan to bend the public narrative to their own designs: "Start looking for [Jewish] numerology and crisis actors."

The voices from this dark corner of the Internet quickly coalesced around a plan of attack: Use details gleaned from news reports and other sources to push false information about one of America's deadliest school shootings.

The posters on anonymous forums, a cauldron of far-right extremist politics, over the next few hours speculated about the shooter's ethnicity ("Hope the kid isn't white") and cracked off-color jokes. They began crafting false explanations about the massacre, including that actors were posing as students, in hopes of blunting what they correctly guessed would be a revived interest in gun control.

The success of this effort would soon illustrate how lies that thrive on raucous online platforms increasingly shape public understanding of major events. As much of the nation mourned, the story concocted on anonymous chat rooms soon burst onto YouTube, Twitter and Facebook, where the theories surged in popularity.

Amid corporate efforts to beat back the falsehoods, the episode became the latest cautionary tale about how the Internet itself had become a potent tool of deception wielded by political extremists, disinformation warriors and conspiracy theorists.

"There's a war going on outside, no man is safe from," said a frequent conspiracy theory poster on the website Reddit, the day after the shooting. "And it is only partially being fought with guns. The real weapon is information and the attack is on the mind."

A Washington Post review of thousands of posts on sites such as 8chan, 4chan and Reddit showed how people on online forums worked aggressively to undermine news reports about a troubled teen accused of killing 17 people, most of them students.

Former YouTube engineer Guillaume Chaslot referred to coordinated campaigns across online platforms to spread a video as "4chan attacks" because such anonymous forums often served as staging grounds for these efforts. YouTube and Facebook have policies against harassment that served as the basis for removing some of the conspiracy theories. But Chaslot said the companies have not done enough to weed out deceptive content.

The Parkland story line took advantage of emerging details about the surviving students — and even how they looked or talked during interviews with television reporters — to portray them as "crisis actors" playing the roles of victims in a "false flag" attack, a hoax designed to mislead the public and build support for gun control.

The campaign threatens to leave long-lasting scars on students and their families, who find themselves linked online to damaging and unsubstantiated theories in havens of misinformation across the Web. Survivors of the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in 2012 and victims' families still are haunted by these online echoes of their trauma, experts say.

"The parents and the families of these murdered children are still being harassed by people online," said Joan Donovan, a researcher at the think tank Data & Society who studies media ma­nipu­la­tion. "That is the legacy of this kind of harassment. For years to come, these students in Parkland are going to have to suffer this same fate."

Parkland student David Hogg, 17, emerged as the centerpiece of the "crisis actor" myth, in part because his father is a retired FBI agent, allowing the "false flag" idea to merge with ongoing conservative attacks on the bureau related to its investigation of President Trump's campaign.

There was little sign on the chat boards of any unease about singling out Parkland survivors and their families for personal attacks. Instead the mood seemed jubilant, with posters celebrating that the campaign had reached a broader audience of "normies," meaning people who typically keep their distance from racist, anti-Semitic and far-right extremist conversation.

"Just wanted to say thanks for all your digging and research," one poster wrote on 8chan. "Extra thanks if you're spreading info or memes about this kid. It's already breaking through the normie-sphere. KEEP PUSHING!"

Anonymous online forums have long incubated politically extreme, racially charged conversation with few rules or concessions to good taste. On 4chan, founded in 2003 and now owned by a Japanese businessman, such chats typically happen on the /pol/ — for "politically incorrect" — message board. 8chan, founded in 2013 by those who considered 4chan too restrictive, also has its own /pol/ board, where the exchanges play out under the heading, "On the jews and Their Lies."

A person who responded to 8chan's administrative email said the board is totally anonymous and allows anyone to "read what users are saying, unfiltered. . . . The 8chan administration is irrelevant and unrelated in this matter." 4chan didn't respond to a request for comment.

Reddit is typically regarded as more mainstream, but the individual message boards, including "r/The_Donald" and "r/conspiracy," hosted harsh attacks on the Parkland students. The site in 2016 closed its thriving "Pizzagate" conspiracy theory message board, a leading source of allegations that a child molestation ring run by Democratic Party luminaries operated out of a Washington pizza shop that led to a real shooting in which no one was hurt. Reddit declined to comment.

Researchers say it's difficult to know whether any single message board was decisive in pushing conspiracy theories about the Parkland shooting to prominence on YouTube and other mainstream sites. But Donovan, the Data & Society researcher, said far-right sites are increasingly capi­tal­izing on current story lines to promote hyperpartisan claims, unsubstantiated conspiracy theories and media attacks in order to boost their audiences and advertising revenue.

"You don't have to know the truth," she said. "It's just as effective to hint that a conspiracy is afoot."

there's way more at the link, but make sure you're sitting down, and have already taken your BP meds.

[Gusington]

^The last line is the important one. "It's just as effective to hint that a conspiracy is afoot."

[mirth]

There's a conspiracy?! I knew it!!!

[Gusington]

Shhh! Don't let the Jews know you're coming. They've ears everywhere!

[em2nought]

I think I might run in if I were POTUS too, by this point in his presidency I'd probably feel I was better off dead than trying to improve this liberal scumbag infested country.   

[Gusington]

^I was the one who tried to mug him.