Dungeon Crawlers?

[Nefaro]

For some reason, I recall it actually having more "stuff" you could find, in the version I played back in the early 80s, and more classes each with a specific ability.  Or am I thinking of a different dungeon crawler from TSR in that period???  The latest versions seem like they culled items, classes, and abilities from the oldies.

you sure you're not thinking of the incarnation of red-bid D&D from that era? ;)

I just remember the name was pretty much the same (it had Dungeon in it) and I vaguely recall there being more classes available.  Like eight or more.  Such craziness as 'Hero' and 'Superhero'.  I don't recall exactly how different each was from the other but there were definitely more.  There also seemed to be a few more usable item cards you could find.

It sounds like...Dungeon.

http://boardgamegeek.com/images/boardgame/1339/dungeon

This is a newer iteration of the game; the first version came out in 1975. I played it in the early/mid 80s a lot.

LOL.  Yeah, that's what we were talking about. 

I was saying that the oldest version(s) had more 'stuff' to it than the later versions.  I'm going from vague memories but the new editions released in the last couple decades have been a bit dumbed down compared to the late 70s/early 80s version.

[Nefaro]

I've played Descent with the kids.  It has a fairly good set-up time.  Also, Descent is really a competitive game- it's the DM vs. the players.  If that's ok with you then fine, but understand that the DM is trying to "win" the game by killing the players just as the players are trying to "win" by beating the dungeon.  The DM doesn't facilitate play like in regular D&D. 

Having said that, if you're into a game that requires at least 2 (preferably 3 or more) to play, Descent is a highly recommended dungeon crawl.  I have the old edition.  Apparently they released a new edition now so you'll likely have to go that route.

Thanks.  I'd actually prefer one with some competitive game mechanics.  I already have a couple co-op ones and those are enough. 

My only concern about Descent was the variety of 'stuff' in it.  It looks like it's a series that you gotta invest lotsa money in expansions to get more than a handful of monsters/times/wotnot in the delves.  I'm also not sure how varied each individual session is or whether it's just a scenario setup with pre-determined dungeon contents.  The latter is probably my biggest concern - canned scenarios or a fair bit of randomization so you're never sure what the party may run into?

On another note, I played the new Dungeonquest the other night with some of the family.  It's still quite brutal and the players often die before succeeding.  Like the "roguelike" of boardgame dungeon crawlers - see who can get further before dying.  But it's still fun, a good deal of variety and randomization, and it plays well with nearly all ages since nearly all the cards with text are turned over and read to the group.  The only reading done is just one special character or monster skill card during a monster attack mini-game, the rest is just playing highest number to win and matching an attack type symbol to see if you can add more in a counterattack to your total.  Pretty easy on the young-uns.  The combat card game system is new since the old 80s version I have but the rulebook still has a few extra optional combat resolution mechanics to use in it's stead if you want to simplify it even more.  I can recommend 3rd Edition Dungeonquest for including their kids that don't read so well but still know their base numbers alright.  If you can find a good copy nowadays.  :-\

[bayonetbrant]

as a possibility for a more contemporary dungeon crawler, you might want to give the Adventurers games a look.

http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgamefamily/10592/the-adventurers

think of it as the boardgame equivalent of the first 15 minutes of an Indiana Jones movie.  Fun settings, a race to escape, some different dangers, and a bunch of grab-the-loot-and-run mechanics.

[BanzaiCat]

LOL.  Yeah, that's what we were talking about. 

I was saying that the oldest version(s) had more 'stuff' to it than the later versions.  I'm going from vague memories but the new editions released in the last couple decades have been a bit dumbed down compared to the late 70s/early 80s version.

Got it. I haven't seen the latest iterations, but I do remember the older version, and can't comprehend how it could have possibly been dumbed down any further. I'll have to check and see if there's a PDF rulebook there on BGG...might be worth a laugh.

[Nefaro]

LOL.  Yeah, that's what we were talking about. 

I was saying that the oldest version(s) had more 'stuff' to it than the later versions.  I'm going from vague memories but the new editions released in the last couple decades have been a bit dumbed down compared to the late 70s/early 80s version.

Got it. I haven't seen the latest iterations, but I do remember the older version, and can't comprehend how it could have possibly been dumbed down any further. I'll have to check and see if there's a PDF rulebook there on BGG...might be worth a laugh.

There are fewer classes in the new edition.  Also, I'm pretty sure that there are fewer usable item cards to find.  What do the new ones have.. just a few sword cards that are the same +1 or +2 bonus that you roll for when you find it?  Weren't there usable potions, rope, keys/lockpicks and other such things in the original?

[BanzaiCat]

I want to say there was only a handful of items, like a +1 sword, with the vast majority of Treasure cards being piles of gold and gems worth lots of gold.

[bayonetbrant]

Weren't there usable potions, rope, keys/lockpicks and other such things in the original?

there were a lot of expansion cards floating around out there.  some from magazines, some homemade, some you can find on BGG or other places

later some of those expansion cards found their way into reprints

[Nefaro]

The more I check out some web details on Dungeoneer, the more it seems to be just what I was looking for.  Thanks for suggesting that Brant, I didn't know about it before. 

I should be receiving it this afternoon, minus one of the expansion packs that will show up next week.  However, I forgot to order some extra 'counters' and such.  I certainly have stuff to use around here but had to turn around and order some for it, specifically, so I don't have to shuffle bits between various games.   I'm also thinking about slicing up some cardboard and attempting some arts & crafts craziness to reinforce the little standee cutouts that come with it, for the same reason.

[bayonetbrant]

just use some random figures laying about for them.  You can also use pennies for much of the tokens.  We used a lot of the gold tokens from the Pirates! series of punch-out card games.

[Nefaro]

just use some random figures laying about for them.  You can also use pennies for much of the tokens.  We used a lot of the gold tokens from the Pirates! series of punch-out card games.

Yeah, I'll use counters & figures from other stuff in the meantime but when I pack it up I want it to have it's own self-contained set of 'stuff'.   I can get by with the paper pieces if I can glue the paper figures to some more durable materials.  I'll definitely need to put all this stuff in a new box, along with the cards, too.  I grabbed a few expansions along with the two full-sized base sets.

It's nice that the rules are short and to the point but the gameplay is still interesting due to the CCG-like card mechanics being able to each dictate their own additional rules or changes to rules.  Doesn't look all that difficult once you get the turn sequence down and it has some of the variety I was looking for.     8)