Wealth Distribution

[LongBlade]

Actually the basic problem solving tool is to look at the conditions/rules/regulations that allowed the situation to occur and adjust them. These factors are so far and away/isolated from the common man as to be considered alien.

What situation occurred? People worked hard and got rich?

I understand: you guys are unhappy there are some people who are wildly wealthy. Got it.

But no one here has made a case that "the system" is rigged against you/me/us/whoever.

Sure, there are rules and regulations. Probably too many (does "smaller government, less spending" sound familiar?). But I don't see how that is some kind of conspiracy against wealth accumulation.

[Mr. Bigglesworth]

You seem to have put on effort to take AJ's position in this thread. I doubt you believe what you are posting.

No I genuinely can't understand what the issue is here. There are some people who are fantastically wealthy. I am not one of them.

So what? I have enough.

While I'd like more I'm not going to go to great lengths to rearrange my life to earn significantly more. I know what I can do to get wealthier but today I'm content to make my family a priority.

Better read up on Jefferson. The guy was brilliant. It was rather annoying to me when I found most of what I considered my personal philosophy he had already written down in the 1800s.

[Steelgrave]

^on top of that, the subject of the video (and discussion) is not wealth RE-distribution, which no one here seems to be in favor of, but rather what the effect of the current distribution of wealth is, the reinforcement of a class system between the haves and the have nots.

I must be missing something.

So you guys are unhappy at the current distribution of wealth but you don't want to redistribute it?

OK, I agree: I wish I were richer, too.

No, I'm absolutely fine with a shrinking middle class offering less opportunities and more debt while demanding a college degree (who's price is wildly inflated) even as the government reallocates more money away from the middle class towards their voter constituencies while filling their pockets with wads of cash from corporations who's voice drowns mine out, corporations which are owned by a small number of people who are not only rich but richer than ever on a percentage basis. It would be wonderful if we could all simply choose to just be rich ourselves, but considering the number of hard working, degreed middle class people who frequent this board and are anything but slackers....yet still find themselves sweating pink slips...I think that's a very 1950's argument.

"They" told us work hard and move up...except there is no company loyalty anymore and we jump from job to job until we are no longer marketable.

"They" told us to get an education because it would ensure our future, then raised the cost of that sheepskin enough to ensure years of debt while devaluing a degree by making it almost mandentory.

"They" tell us the other guy is out to get us when in fact "they" all take money from the same big banks and corporations.

I have no issue with people who work hard and get rich. It's the people and institutions who amass the wealth and then break down the ladders for other's to do the same by buying our country that I have an issue with. Does anyone really think the combined votes of everyone on this board matter as much to a politician as the single voice of a corporation stuffing cash into their campaign? I know surgeons who are barely making it, restaurant managers who worked their way up from washing dishes and have zero job security, veterans with college degrees who can't land a job and lawyers working as Paralegals because of the job market.

Not rigged??? Ok. Then I guess there's nothing to see here, folks. Move on, live your lives and try to enjoy whatever trickle down comes your way. Just keep your head down. It's safer that way.

[GDS_Starfury]

I remember there being a solution to this whole mess.

[Dolan50]

Is that from the movie Papillon with Steve McQueen :)

We can do a Zombie apocalypse on the poor and homeless and blame terrorists for tampering with the flu vaccine or the water supply using hallucinogenics and then pretend it was all just a national nightmare.

Don't know how far that would go in solving the problem of wealth distribution,but at least we wouldn't have to figure them into the equation anymore. :)

[Keunert]

i don't want to see a correction by taxes. i rather want to see some public pressure on those companies, like the pressure companies get if they employ third world kids or chinese women etc... i mostly buy biological food and i do not buy at the zalando online store etc.

if mcdonalds or any other firm plays the system, aiding their employes to get food stamps and government help rather than paying a decent wage than i feel played myself by this company. i will not buy from a company that choses to get some of my tax money for their own profit.

[Dolan50]

We had some pretty decent measures put into place in this country the last time the corporate bigwigs got out of line and started corrupting the economy and the govt. with their selfish interests in the late 19th and early 20th century.

The system of checks and balances worked fairly well up until the Reagan administration.

Too bad are so called elected reps in all their infinite wisdom both R and D decided that our corporations are ethical and socially conscience enough to self regulate themselves and these companies only have the countries best interest at heart and are not just mercenary profit motivated entities.

I guess the only thing we learned from that lesson is Americans can't be bothered with history.

[airboy]

We had some pretty decent measures put into place in this country the last time the corporate bigwigs got out of line and started corrupting the economy and the govt. with their selfish interests in the late 19th and early 20th century.

The system of checks and balances worked fairly well up until the Reagan administration.

Too bad are so called elected reps in all their infinite wisdom both R and D decided that our corporations are ethical and socially conscience enough to self regulate themselves and these companies only have the countries best interest at heart and are not just mercenary profit motivated entities.

I guess the only thing we learned from that lesson is Americans can't be bothered with history.

You guys really have your facts wrong.  The income tax system has become much, much more progressive since Reagan.
The bottom 40% of US households got an average government check of approximately $19,000.  The top 20% of income households paid almost all of the tax.

This is a new story today based on the Congressional Budget Office
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/cbotop-40-paid-1062-income-taxes-bottom-40-paid-91-got-average-18950

The idea that business is "self-regulated" is also wrong.  Have you ever seen the rules and regulations all US businesses must follow?  Have you seen the floor to ceiling stacks of regulations that companies with 50+ employees must follow?

Once again - the actual data shows that those with high incomes pay almost all of the US Federal Taxes
US Corporations pay some of the absolute highest taxes in the world (both statutory & effective tax rates).
US Business is under far, far more regulations now than they were under Reagan.

[Dolan50]

You mean the rules and regulations that these big companies lobbied for to stifle competition from smaller businesses with less capital and the rules and regulations that they will lobby to dismantle just as quickly once they achieve their goals of monopoly status.

[Windigo]

Actually the basic problem solving tool is to look at the conditions/rules/regulations that allowed the situation to occur and adjust them. These factors are so far and away/isolated from the common man as to be considered alien.

What situation occurred? People worked hard and got rich?

I understand: you guys are unhappy there are some people who are wildly wealthy. Got it.

But no one here has made a case that "the system" is rigged against you/me/us/whoever.

Sure, there are rules and regulations. Probably too many (does "smaller government, less spending" sound familiar?). But I don't see how that is some kind of conspiracy against wealth accumulation.

Lets get this straight... you are saying that its factually desireable for well less than 1% of the population to have over 1/3rd of all total wealth (and growing), while everyone else's is dropping?

Yes or no Mr. Oversimplify.

And no one said the system is rigged and no one said anything negative about people working hard and getting rich ... you're being obtuse (oh I am soooo familiar with this version of LB)


please stick to what people are actually saying and not vilifying them for what you cartoonishly thing their saying

[airboy]

You mean the rules and regulations that these big companies lobbied for to stifle competition from smaller businesses with less capital and the rules and regulations that they will lobby to dismantle just as quickly once they achieve their goals of monopoly status.

Some of the rules work that way.  Dems never, ever cut government regulations since Jimmy Carter deregulated the transportation industry in the USA (one of the best things he ever did).

I hate crony capitalism.  Dems are the worst at it but the Republicans share a lot of the blame.

But still, most of the government regulations come from democrats.  They are done both to help their buddies (green energy) or because there is some "wrong" that needed to be righted.

The more powerful government is, and the more it interferes with the economy, the better the payoff for insiders of any type to pay off the politicians or the regulators to get the "law" written in a manner that benefits their special interest.  But facts are facts.  The bigger the government and the more it meddles, the more opportunities you have for this sort of thing to occur.

[GDS_Starfury]

kinda like that last 6 years.  ::)

[Steelgrave]

You mean the rules and regulations that these big companies lobbied for to stifle competition from smaller businesses with less capital and the rules and regulations that they will lobby to dismantle just as quickly once they achieve their goals of monopoly status.

Some of the rules work that way.  Dems never, ever cut government regulations since Jimmy Carter deregulated the transportation industry in the USA (one of the best things he ever did).

I hate crony capitalism.  Dems are the worst at it but the Republicans share a lot of the blame.

But still, most of the government regulations come from democrats.  They are done both to help their buddies (green energy) or because there is some "wrong" that needed to be righted.

The more powerful government is, and the more it interferes with the economy, the better the payoff for insiders of any type to pay off the politicians or the regulators to get the "law" written in a manner that benefits their special interest.  But facts are facts.  The bigger the government and the more it meddles, the more opportunities you have for this sort of thing to occur.

Which is why I am of the opinion that the middle class is having the life sucked out of it from both ends of the economic spectrum.......

[LongBlade]

Lets get this straight... you are saying that its factually desireable for well less than 1% of the population to have over 1/3rd of all total wealth (and growing), while everyone else's is dropping?

Yes or no Mr. Oversimplify.

I'm saying I don't care.

[LongBlade]

And no one said the system is rigged and no one said anything negative about people working hard and getting rich ... you're being obtuse (oh I am soooo familiar with this version of LB)


please stick to what people are actually saying and not vilifying them for what you cartoonishly thing their saying

My apologies again. I'm not intentionally trying to take things out of context.