...great. Well, here's hoping they get this one better than the last iterations...
And if you can get past the constant "uhhh...uhhhhhhhhhhhs" in this one, it's a decent gameplay vid:
I really REALLY want to like this game. I'm just tired of being disappointed in their computer versions.
I really dig Blood Bowl and have every iteration of it so far. BC, you should have joined GJK's Vassal Blood Bowl League. It was a blast...until it unexpectedly folded.
I'll probably pick this version up as well. Cyanide may fail on most games but I thought they did a good job with Blood Bowl.
I thought seriously about joining, KyzBP, but the spare time I did have had been dedicated to GH reviews and AARs. I just didn't/don't have the time to get too heavily involved in a time-sink like that, no matter how awesome it is, and I didn't want to half-ass it, so I declined. The computerized version, I might be able to pull off as part of an MP league, if BB2 supports that.
day 1 purchase - i see theyve already pissed off the community with 2 bonus races if you pre order - not yet released and the dlc gouging begins
That's definitely a problem for me, having races purchased separately - that's the crap they did in the iOS version and exactly the reason why I didn't buy it on that platform. I'll have to wait and see. If this is another 'only Orcs and Humans and everything else is $5 each' then I think I might pass on this one, too.
it comes with the standard 8, and the 2 bonus ones are wood elves and someone i cant remember - its what they did with the first edition
Quote from: undercovergeek on July 11, 2015, 01:51:05 PM
day 1 purchase - i see theyve already pissed off the community with 2 bonus races if you pre order - not yet released and the dlc gouging begins
Eight races at release..and if you pre-order, you don't get two new races...you get your choice of one of two.
Straight cash grab..and at $45 for eight initial races, this sucks hard.
I will wait a year or two, and wait for the specials to hit. I am in no mood to purchase DLC, 3-4 teams at a time, every three months for two years.
Always was interested in trying one of the computer versions, but never bit....just curious, which version would be the best to pick up now if one wanted to give it a try?
Grim, unless you want to try multiplayer, I'd avoid BB. The game's AI is atrocious in single-player play, and it cheats something awful with die rolls.
That's my .02, anyway. I don't know if there are mods out there to even things out.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 11, 2015, 03:50:26 PM
Grim, unless you want to try multiplayer, I'd avoid BB. The game's AI is atrocious in single-player play, and it cheats something awful with die rolls.
That's my .02, anyway. I don't know if there are mods out there to even things out.
Ok, good to know...guess hold off until version 2 comes out.
Well, that's just my experience. I own the Legendary Edition myself. That one is $19.99 on Steam right now, and the Chaos Edition is 29.99. They do go on sale every so often, so while you wait for BB2 to go down in price, if either BB version gets gutted in price you might want to take a look at it. I don't think there's ANY way either the Chaos or Legendary edition is worth their current prices, but for five bucks, it might give you some entertainment, if anything because it's BB.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 11, 2015, 05:21:28 PM
Well, that's just my experience. I own the Legendary Edition myself. That one is $19.99 on Steam right now, and the Chaos Edition is 29.99. They do go on sale every so often, so while you wait for BB2 to go down in price, if either BB version gets gutted in price you might want to take a look at it. I don't think there's ANY way either the Chaos or Legendary edition is worth their current prices, but for five bucks, it might give you some entertainment, if anything because it's BB.
I had seen the Chaos version for about $10, but sounds like that might be too much as well:)
The only problem I had with the previous version was the same as the whole of them: the AI was too simple and often too stupid.
Despite the individual teams having different play styles, they only had one style programmed for the AI to do. Which only played to the strengths of a few teams.
It was complained about so much, they started off the AI teams with more experienced players (in the latest version) in order to provide more of an artificial challenge at the default level. Lazy way of doing it.
They obviously didn't want to do any more AI work and I'm concerned they will take the same route with this new one, using the same overly simple AI that always walks a slow Bruiser Cage down the field. ::)
Well.... I take that back. I had a second problem. The bad net code that would often lose sync, and even drop the multi-player match when it couldn't re-sync fast enough. :knuppel2: I had played numerous people in Europe and it was a constant problem no matter which IP.
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on July 11, 2015, 03:58:18 PM
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 11, 2015, 03:50:26 PM
Grim, unless you want to try multiplayer, I'd avoid BB. The game's AI is atrocious in single-player play, and it cheats something awful with die rolls.
That's my .02, anyway. I don't know if there are mods out there to even things out.
Ok, good to know...guess hold off until version 2 comes out.
I own the Chaos Edition (which is Legendary Edition adding the few remaining factions not yet released), and I have never once seen it cheat dice rolls.
While it does like the bruiser cage tactic -- which it should because it's a good tactic -- I have seen it try other things, too, including bobbing a goatman behind its line drawing me inward until it dashed for a straight throw to a decent catcher it had infiltrated near my goal that I never even noticed.
My narrative BB:CE AAR is linked in my sig, two seasons worth of initial campaign. There were some UI oddities I didn't like, but otherwise I was very satisfied with the experience. To be fair to those complaining about one standard AI, though, I didn't play against any especially fast teams. (Skaven, yes, but they have heavies, too, and the AI mixed up fairly well on a turn-by-turn basis according to what looked to it like the best tactic under the circumstances.)
Quote from: JasonPratt on July 11, 2015, 07:29:51 PM
I have never once seen it cheat dice rolls.
http://steamcommunity.com/app/216890/discussions/0/828923952115878738/
http://steamcommunity.com/app/216890/discussions/0/864951022529573867/
http://steamcommunity.com/app/58520/discussions/0/810938811085746906/?insideModal=1
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1995461
And on and on and on.
There's enough unique posts complaining about the AI fudging its die rolls in its favor that it can't be just randomness. Sure, it's die-generated, and sure, that's a lot of random chance, but there's plenty of other games with similar generation mechanics that don't get nearly this amount of complaints.
And while I can see both sides of the story, every time I miss it and re-install and play, it pulls this same stuff every time. I consider myself to be a pretty strong BB player as I did it quite a bit back in the day, but this game really frustrates the hell out of me.
That's not to say it's ALWAYS like that. I've won more than a few games against the AI. But mostly it's an exercise in saying over and over and over again, "are you freakin' KIDDING me with these rolls?"
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 11, 2015, 05:21:28 PM
Well, that's just my experience. I own the Legendary Edition myself. That one is $19.99 on Steam right now, and the Chaos Edition is 29.99. They do go on sale every so often, so while you wait for BB2 to go down in price, if either BB version gets gutted in price you might want to take a look at it. I don't think there's ANY way either the Chaos or Legendary edition is worth their current prices, but for five bucks, it might give you some entertainment, if anything because it's BB.
I had Legendary edition but upgraded to the Chaos edition in the GG sale - I paid a pittance for it, as I already had the Legendary edition.
Just give me my Dwarves and and a bleepin Deathroller and I'll see you on the pitch. :knuppel2:
B_C; haven't read the other threads yet, but that first thread contained ample testimony to the game NOT cheating its dice rolls: both with a technical interview about how the RNG works, and with testimony of similar things happening in live BB games (plus some brief comments on distribution bias making it seem like the AI is cheating).
I did learn from that thread, by the way, that the urban legend that it cheats is partially based on misunderstanding what the probmodifier code in its program does: on harder AI levels the game plays more conservatively by sticking closer to calculated expected probabilities.
http://forum.bloodbowl-game.com/viewtopic.php?p=488#p488
I suspect this explains the tendency to cage up rather than to play an air game even with an airy-fairy faction. >:D (But it may just not have a good code for how to play as the elves either.)
One comment did quickly summarize how the game DOES cheat OUTSIDE matches -- and I've seen evidence of this. "It can pull fresh players out of its ♥♥♥ immediately, gets more more money and SPP per AI-vs.AI-match than mathematically possible, gets guaranteed doubles rolls on over half its skillups, never runs out of money..."
Quote from: JasonPratt on July 11, 2015, 07:29:51 PM
To be fair to those complaining about one standard AI, though, I didn't play against any especially fast teams. (Skaven, yes, but they have heavies, too, and the AI mixed up fairly well on a turn-by-turn basis according to what looked to it like the best tactic under the circumstances.)
The Skaven is one example. Another good example of the one-size-fits-all AI debacle is the Wood Elves. The most fragile passing-est team boxes up and tries to brute force it down the field, getting all their players injured and killed in the process. ::)
What's more, the AI has always passed
less when set to the higher difficulty level AI. So while it does a bit better job at the one thing it does (caging), it also passes even less. I saw numerous posts, years ago, telling people to set the AI back to normal level if they ever want it to pass much. Even then, it does so at poorly chosen times.
Instead of creating one or two extra specialty AI play styles, they adopted a modder's previous answer to make the single-player campaign more difficult in the last version... giving the AI teams a head start 'cheat' (more points at the beginning). :-\
I've enjoyed all the iterations of PC BB, despite it's two big problems (single-player AI and the faulty net code). I'm hoping they address both of those this time around. I'll wait to find out, however.
Quote from: KyzBP on July 11, 2015, 12:28:01 PM
I really dig Blood Bowl and have every iteration of it so far. BC, you should have joined GJK's Vassal Blood Bowl League. It was a blast...until it unexpectedly folded.
I'll probably pick this version up as well. Cyanide may fail on most games but I thought they did a good job with Blood Bowl.
We were having fun in the league. The commish was a great guy but obviously a *very* experienced player as he was having his way with all of us and I think that sort of took the air out of the sails a bit. I know that it did mine.
The VASSAL module works like a charm and I'm happy to share it with anybody interested in it. I'd post it to the VASSAL website but GW would have it pulled immediately I'm sure. Of course there's no a.i. with the VASSAL module
either but it does work *great* for Pbem so if your time is limited that could be an option for you as it literally takes 10 minutes or so to play and send a turn. I'd also certainly entertain the thought of starting up another league from guys here if the interest were there.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 12, 2015, 12:10:24 AM
Quote from: JasonPratt on July 11, 2015, 07:29:51 PM
To be fair to those complaining about one standard AI, though, I didn't play against any especially fast teams. (Skaven, yes, but they have heavies, too, and the AI mixed up fairly well on a turn-by-turn basis according to what looked to it like the best tactic under the circumstances.)
The Skaven is one example. Another good example of the one-size-fits-all AI debacle is the Wood Elves. The most fragile passing-est team boxes up and tries to brute force it down the field, getting all their players injured and killed in the process. ::)
Well, the Skaven didn't pass much, but they're a surprisingly heavy team, with a few blazingly fast types, so I wouldn't call it a debacle. There's no point passing compared to nimbly running the ball if there's nowhere to pass to, and I played a good enough Amazon game to keep the leakers down; or to mess with the odds of making a good catch and throw even when they had someone downfield who could catch -- and a Skaven team,
especially one that isn't very experienced yet (which will be the case of any campaign for a long time), will not actually have a lot of good catchers to spare, unlike a dedicated air-game team.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 12, 2015, 12:10:24 AMWhat's more, the AI has always passed less when set to the higher difficulty level AI. So while it does a bit better job at the one thing it does (caging), it also passes even less. I saw numerous posts, years ago, telling people to set the AI back to normal level if they ever want it to pass much. Even then, it does so at poorly chosen times.
That's because it's calculating the odds and playing more conservatively with the odds on higher levels: and a passing game intrinsically has more odds in its calculation. Even if the odds are good (as for an elven team, or for certain Skaven builds, or for certain long-term Chaos builds for that matter), a bunch of good odds that all have to go right may still be riskier than a few good odds.
The problem there is that no one taught the computer that what seems like better short odds can be much worse when you're playing as a physically weak race: it couldn't factor how likely a ground game is to be busted with weak players instead of strong ones.
No doubt this would be compounded by an inexperienced air team, which hampers its ability to put together strings of probability rolls.
This is all compounded (I realized this morning) by certain design issues which the computer game is completely faithful to, and which haunt the board game, too: the game naturally punishes a team who falls into a deficit of players on the field (which is why one legitimate strategy is to wound or kill the other team's crew), and a few bad rolls early in the game can thus cripple a team for the rest of the game. Or even, because the scores tend to be low, bring about a loss late game -- but the scores tending to be low, also affects the importance any burst of good or bad luck by proportion. BB2 isn't going to change any of that, and probably shouldn't, because it's one of the things human players really like: most games come down to the wire because any advantage can be negated by a few good or bad rolls in a string. A player struggling along with a crippled team is more likely to lose (and so it's annoying that a string of bad rolls, or good ones for the other team, can cause this quickly out of nowhere), but it only takes a string of favorable rolls to suddenly even the field, too, or to punch past the stronger field for epic David/Goliath situations.
Has anyone played blood bowl here (FUMBBL) (https://fumbbl.com/)? It looks like it uses some java client to play.
Yeah, I very much enjoyed the original BB, despite the problems that Nefaro pointed out. I'm hoping that limiting the number of teams from 23 down to a fairly "disappointing" 8 will mean they will personalize each AI a bit more.
I put disappointing in quotes, because I actually did not care for most of the teams in the latest BB (Chaos). That many teams just made it far too hard for a person coming in from the cold (me) to learn the nuances of each team. I like a more focused approach. That being said, I would have much rather they offered the Undead as a bonus DLC team than the Wood Elves.
Quote from: vyshka on July 12, 2015, 11:45:10 AM
Has anyone played blood bowl here (FUMBBL) (https://fumbbl.com/)? It looks like it uses some java client to play.
FUMBBL is a great way to play if you want to join a league. There's lots of players and league options. I never could find if it has a way for you to just play a one-off game with a buddy or if you have to join and play in a league. It confused me to the point that I just made the VASSAL module for it. Regardless, neither have an a.i. Oh, and you can't pbem FUMBBL, which was actually the biggest reason for making a VASSAL module for it (BB is *very* pbem friendly with its turn structure the way that it is).
Quote from: GJK on July 12, 2015, 06:00:09 PM
Quote from: vyshka on July 12, 2015, 11:45:10 AM
Has anyone played blood bowl here (FUMBBL) (https://fumbbl.com/)? It looks like it uses some java client to play.
FUMBBL is a great way to play if you want to join a league. There's lots of players and league options. I never could find if it has a way for you to just play a one-off game with a buddy or if you have to join and play in a league. It confused me to the point that I just made the VASSAL module for it. Regardless, neither have an a.i. Oh, and you can't pbem FUMBBL, which was actually the biggest reason for making a VASSAL module for it (BB is *very* pbem friendly with its turn structure the way that it is).
I tried FUMBBL as well. I can't put my finger on it but there was just something I didn't like. It may have been the animations. On the other hand I really enjoyed the VASSAL module. Once you got the hang of it, it was pretty smooth and a lot of fun.
Quote from: KyzBP on July 12, 2015, 06:58:21 PM
I tried FUMBBL as well. I can't put my finger on it but there was just something I didn't like. It may have been the animations. On the other hand I really enjoyed the VASSAL module. Once you got the hang of it, it was pretty smooth and a lot of fun.
I think that we need to start up a pbem game! What do you say? :)
Quote from: GJK on July 12, 2015, 08:13:09 PM
Quote from: KyzBP on July 12, 2015, 06:58:21 PM
I tried FUMBBL as well. I can't put my finger on it but there was just something I didn't like. It may have been the animations. On the other hand I really enjoyed the VASSAL module. Once you got the hang of it, it was pretty smooth and a lot of fun.
I think that we need to start up a pbem game! What do you say? :)
I would really like to however, the WitP:AE game plus AAR I have going with Undercovergeek right now has sucked up all my spare time. Once I get a better routine going I'll PM you. It really was a lot of fun.
This is probably a dumb question.....but with BB2 being available now for beta, was "thinking" of possibly picking it up.....I will only play single player mode and understand the AI might be questionable. But can someone tell me how the single player portion works? I have read about a campaign mode for single player, but not sure I really want something like that. Maybe I was thinking about this wrong, but I was hoping single player mode was something like me picking a single team and then being able to play in a league against bunch of AI teams...I have no desire to really play out a story...just want to play a bunch of league games.....is that possible?
Rps has done a good piece on it and they mention a football manager style league with players ageing and retiring and you been able to customise the aspects of the league
Thanks...now just read that, seems like it will have what I want...now just debating to pick up now or later:)
Although there's a tiny voice at the back of your mind saying later later later
You know it will be now!
It's Cyanide. I wouldn't pre-order a Cyanide title if the bonus was hookers and blow.
The notion that I would not buy a BB game was absurd, so, well, I did...
I'm VERY, VERY, VERY early into this "final" BETA that they've released on Steam, but, my goodness, I'm having a good time. Mind you, I'm already frustrated by what I'm sure will be the extorionate path they will take with DLC teams (I'm deeply bitter that my Bretonians are wait-listed for final release), but the gameplay is greatly streamlined, the graphics engine is a real joy, and the A.I. has clearly been bumped from where it was.
Haven't tried any MP because my usual group is asleep, but the Men of the Verdant Bay are getting ready to fire out of the tunnel any time now...
If BB2 is truly a superior product to all the BB1 iterations (Chaos, Legendary, etc. - and that's not a high bar to clear), I'll put it on my radar. But there's no way I'm paying full price for it. I'll wait for super sale.
Among the "new features" listed on their site is mention of each team having their own custom AI for utilizing their specific play style.
That's exactly what the original needed. I'm still waiting to hear about how well that turned out, however.
Well, I decided to purchase...this will be my first game of any Blood Bowl type so not sure how it will go...but intrigued enough to at least try....since it is pre-order, can return for a refund prior to the release anyway:)
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 06:18:24 AM
Well, I decided to purchase...this will be my first game of any Blood Bowl type so not sure how it will go...but intrigued enough to at least try....since it is pre-order, can return for a refund prior to the release anyway:)
I think that once you've installed it, even betas are subject to the 2 weeks/2 hours limitation. But it never hurts to try. Steam customer service now looks at any refund request, and will agree if it's not too far outside of those parameters.
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 06:31:50 AM
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 06:18:24 AM
Well, I decided to purchase...this will be my first game of any Blood Bowl type so not sure how it will go...but intrigued enough to at least try....since it is pre-order, can return for a refund prior to the release anyway:)
I think that once you've installed it, even betas are subject to the 2 weeks/2 hours limitation. But it never hurts to try. Steam customer service now looks at any refund request, and will agree if it's not too far outside of those parameters.
According to their refund policy, looks like it is an option...I have done it in the past with another beta, without issues.
Refunds on Pre-Purchased Titles
When you pre-purchase a title on Steam (and have paid for the title in advance), you can request a refund at any time prior to release of that title. The standard 14-day/two-hour refund period also applies, starting on the game's release date.
Bought it god dammit ;) No key yet bought through GMG with 25% discount code
Quote from: FlickJax on September 13, 2015, 06:37:17 AM
Bought it god dammit ;) No key yet bought through GMG with 25% discount code
Don't believe any of the cd key stores will be delivering the keys during the beta...at least all the ones I checked out, appears you have to but through Steam to get the beta,
My first impressions after first match......boy, do I have a lot to learn....no idea what the heck I am doing:)
Lost 2-0 against the AI, couldn't do anything right, probably doesn't help that I know nothing about the rules and such...will have to search for a manual somewhere. The graphics seem really nice and overall good environment (i.e. stadium, fans cheering, etc.) but I can see the cut scenes becoming repetitive even though they look good (appears to be options to reduce them). User Interface seemed fine to me, could do what I wanted, I just didn't know what I wanted to do:) Its interesting how the match is set for 16 turns (8 per half), kind of thinking scoring will always be low...not sure if there is a way to change the length or not yet, but maybe there is a good reason it is that short.
I'll have to learn more about this before I can really judge the gameplay, but certainly has garnered my attention...
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 07:28:51 AM
My first impressions after first match......boy, do I have a lot to learn....no idea what the heck I am doing:)
Lost 2-0 against the AI, couldn't do anything right, probably doesn't help that I know nothing about the rules and such...will have to search for a manual somewhere. The graphics seem really nice and overall good environment (i.e. stadium, fans cheering, etc.) but I can see the cut scenes becoming repetitive even though they look good (appears to be options to reduce them). User Interface seemed fine to me, could do what I wanted, I just didn't know what I wanted to do:) Its interesting how the match is set for 16 turns (8 per half), kind of thinking scoring will always be low...not sure if there is a way to change the length or not yet, but maybe there is a good reason it is that short.
I'll have to learn more about this before I can really judge the gameplay, but certainly has garnered my attention...
Here's a link to the Living Rule Book for Blood Bowl: http://www.bloodbowlonline.com/LivingRulebook5.pdf (http://www.bloodbowlonline.com/LivingRulebook5.pdf)
Don't think of it as American Football. The scores will reflect soccer more than any other sport and the game plays more like Rugby with forward passes.
Once you get into a league you'll be glad the game is only 16 turns. Depending on which team you choose, you'll be accumulating injured and dead players at an alarming rate. Sometimes Turn 16 is the difference between limping away with your wounded to fight another day and having to start all over with a fresh team.
The game is an absolute blast. I will guarantee, Grim, that if you give it enough time you'll fall in love with it. Like I've said before, I've owned all the Cyanide versions of the game and haven't been disappointed.
Now, if you enjoy the painting of miniatures and sitting face to face with an opponent then check out the table top version and blame me later for the totally unnecessary purchases you'll make because the miniatures are so darned cool.
Thanks for the rulebook and I for sure will review....just curious though, any strategy guides exist for the PC version? Something that would give hints/strategy on how to setup things and take advantage of your team's strength's/weakness?
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 08:20:03 AM
Thanks for the rulebook and I for sure will review....just curious though, any strategy guides exist for the PC version? Something that would give hints/strategy on how to setup things and take advantage of your team's strength's/weakness?
http://bbtactics.com/strategy/races/ (http://bbtactics.com/strategy/races/)
The computer version plays exactly like the version so these strategies should be relevant.
In the original you could only save during a match against the AI when the ball turned over. Does it work the same way here?
(I can't believe my resolve is weakening)
...wait, I can install BB2 now?
!!JOY!!
{doing that}
Although this is also likely to impel me to try for a season 3 with my Amazons on BB1:Chaos Edition...
Grim, as a general gameplay hint, I'd argue that the most important thing to understand regardless of which team you're playing as or who you're playing against, is that this is a game about gaining and losing initiative.
Which sounds abstract. But if you're thinking in terms of a time clock or about American football time/field management with stopping an offense and getting back on offense, you're probably going to be constantly out of synch with what's happening in the game. One team gets first initiative at the start of a half, the other team gets first initiative at the start of the second half, and any single substantial failure by any member of a team will shift initiative back to the other team. Or initiative shifts over (ideally) once a team has done everything they can as well as they can with their initiative.
Quote from: Nefaro on September 13, 2015, 06:08:02 AM
Among the "new features" listed on their site is mention of each team having their own custom AI for utilizing their specific play style.
That's exactly what the original needed. I'm still waiting to hear about how well that turned out, however.
The rps piece mentions the dwarf ai fighting like hell to get in the lead and then shutting up shop and turtling - exactly how the dwarves should be played
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 10:43:44 AM
In the original you could only save during a match against the AI when the ball turned over. Does it work the same way here?
(I can't believe my resolve is weakening)
At least with the beta version and in single player offline play, I couldn't actually find anyway to save the game at all in the middle of a match...might be just me not knowing where to look.
Quote from: undercovergeek on September 13, 2015, 01:42:22 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on September 13, 2015, 06:08:02 AM
Among the "new features" listed on their site is mention of each team having their own custom AI for utilizing their specific play style.
That's exactly what the original needed. I'm still waiting to hear about how well that turned out, however.
The rps piece mentions the dwarf ai fighting like hell to get in the lead and then shutting up shop and turtling - exactly how the dwarves should be played
That's the kind of news which makes my resolve weaken, too.
If they've improved the AI by customizing it for each team, then my first reason for fence-sitting is gone.
Don't get me wrong. I did enjoy the Online multi-player leagues quite a bit in the original series, when the terrible netcode wasn't causing it to de-sync and lose connection. But this absolutely must have a decent single-player opponent since the timer restrictions in MP require your full attention for a whole match. Not something I'm always willing or able to do.
If you truly can't save anywhere during a game against the AI, that would make it a non-starter for me at any price.
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 06:11:40 PM
If you truly can't save anywhere during a game against the AI, that would make it a non-starter for me at any price.
Could be that I haven't found out how or because beta...don't know.
Best I can tell there's nothing there for an in-game save.
Now, there's a TON of stuff (notably races) that isn't available as this is a BETA and all. Lots of complaints about very limited graphics tweakability. Also, despite clear representations to the contrary, I cannot get a controller to work to save my soul.
We'll certainly see what release brings, but, despite all this, I really do like this game so far...
Sounds like it's got a ways to go, and the release is slated for what? Next week?
I've been tempted, but it seems like there are plenty bugs to squash and much content yet to be added. :smiley6600:
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 06:11:40 PM
If you truly can't save anywhere during a game against the AI, that would make it a non-starter for me at any price.
I find this attitude hard to understand. It's like saying you won't buy a Total War game because you can't save in the middle of a battle.
Quote from: Toonces on September 14, 2015, 05:46:15 AM
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 06:11:40 PM
If you truly can't save anywhere during a game against the AI, that would make it a non-starter for me at any price.
I find this attitude hard to understand. It's like saying you won't buy a Total War game because you can't save in the middle of a battle.
Two jobs, family & a life meant my gaming time is limited - sometimes to as little as 15 minutes at a stretch. Often I'll fire up a turn based game and have time for only 2 or 3 turns. And yes, manys the time I've had to quite TW in the middle of a battle and lost my progress, which is why I don't play them as much as I would like.
I fear there's some misunderstanding about what this early release is supposed to be. It's billed as an MP BETA which in my experience had always been something of a stress test for the network code and the corporate servers (if any). I was honestly surprised there was even an A.I. opponent available. Still, in this "grabby hands", "gimme now" era we live in -- I tend to be a horrible offender in this regard -- what used to have a more specific purpose has been multi-tasked to, in this instance, provide an inducement to accrue those precious pre-orders.
I just hope the code is stable enough to build a Grogheads league...
Best,
Jim
"Cyrano"
:/7)
P.S.: One thing that tells me the game is well-implemented is the constant complaining about the strategy (really, there's only one), employed by the stunties. This is one of the reasons I ordered the Wood Elves as my "free" DLC.
I'm not of the "Gimme Now" mentality when it comes to Blood Bowl 2. I'm quite happy waiting for it to be finished and relatively bug-free.
But with official release coming a week from tomorrow, typical beta bugginess, and (most notably) numerous teams still absent from the early access beta, I have doubts as to whether all the bugs will be ironed out on official release eight days from now.
I have no problem waiting for it to mature before buying. There is plenty else to do until it's in a condition I'm happy with. :)
Fair enough tgb, that makes sense.
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 06:37:10 AM
Quote from: tgb on September 13, 2015, 06:31:50 AM
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on September 13, 2015, 06:18:24 AM
Well, I decided to purchase...this will be my first game of any Blood Bowl type so not sure how it will go...but intrigued enough to at least try....since it is pre-order, can return for a refund prior to the release anyway:)
I think that once you've installed it, even betas are subject to the 2 weeks/2 hours limitation. But it never hurts to try. Steam customer service now looks at any refund request, and will agree if it's not too far outside of those parameters.
I just tried to get a refund on Armello, since they still don't know why 1.0 crashes for a lot of people using Windows 10. I was denied because I had more than 2 hours invested (almost all of it when it was till in Early Access).
According to their refund policy, looks like it is an option...I have done it in the past with another beta, without issues.
Refunds on Pre-Purchased Titles
When you pre-purchase a title on Steam (and have paid for the title in advance), you can request a refund at any time prior to release of that title. The standard 14-day/two-hour refund period also applies, starting on the game's release date.
Regarding saving during a game; from what I could tell poking around on it very briefly the other night (my controller worked fine so far as that went, which wasn't far just into some menus, btw), if you aren't connected on line you can't save anything -- trying to continue offline leads to an extensive warning about this -- which I figured also meant being unable to save a game at any time when offline.
Which logically would also include 'during a match'.
However, if people have been playing single-player online, and can't save during a match, that would scotch the theory that the problem is not being online.
@Jason -- What controller did you get to work?
I'd have a nice evening set up if I could get my Xbox 360 to work so my son and I could play head-to-head.
Jim
If somebody is wanting to pbem Blood Bowl (for free), then let me know - see my thread down in the Tabletop AAR's thread for more details. Time investment is 10-15 min per turn a few times a week. It's not as pretty but it works (quite nicely I might add).
It's an XBox360 controller, wired. I bought the version specifically for PC, but I don't know how much difference that really makes (no difference in cost.)
GJK's Vassal module is slick. O0
I don't want (er, didn't want to) hijack this thread so if you guys want to discuss the VASSAL module version, I have the thread down in the Tabletop AAR section. I will say however that I'm in communication with Damien, the guy that did a wonderful job of GM'ing the league last time so we could probably put something together if you guys (and others!) are interested down the road.
Patch released...
General info on the patch:
- Size of the update : 530 MB
- In Game (feedback, HUD) :
o Fix an error when you click on a thrower after setting up a pass
o Wild animal tooltip isn't displayed anymore at the end of a turn
o Fix visual effects on players (Death, KO and injury) during half-time cutscene
o Fix a GUI issue when you throw a goblin team mate on your player
o The crowdsurf cutscene is not displayed anymore if you desactivated cutscenes.
- Menu :
o Administrator and redactor have a specific font in the administration board
o Multiplayer league : reward window isn't displayed twice anymore
o Correct competition title and name when you add a Coach in a competition
o Fix of an error when you lose an auction
o The team filter is now working properly on the ranking board
- Gameplay :
o The player kicking the ball can now blitz during a Blitz event
o Interception reroll during a Dump Off doesn't cost a Team reroll to the opponent team anymore
o Fix the error preventing from blizting and then getting up with the contextual menu
o You don't loose the ball with StripBall on a chainpush anymore
o Strip Ball + Juggernaut : the player is pushed then drop the ball
o During a Blitz event, MA are properly consumed by a Blitz
o Loner is now rolled on an interception reroll
o No more lag in multiplayer after failing Always Hungry with a non-eaten goblin
o A player on the ground being chain pushed can't use Side Step and Stand Firm anymore
o A player can't stand up after Piling On anymore
o A Journeymen injured during a game stays injured after the game
o The Interception patron is now conform to the LRB6
- Crash :
o Fix a crash on the post game window
o Fix a crash when refusing an offer in the marketplace
So, had a rare night off yesterday, went home and downloaded the release version...
1: Given that the patch was all of 45 MB, clearly all the races were lurking in there waiting for unlock...fascinating...
2: Nope, no in-game save. This makes sense, I suppose, for MP matches, but NONE for off-line. Foolish omission...
3: The campaign, intended as a tutorial, is utterly disposable. The first game actually lets you play Blood Bowl without tackle dice (everybody knocks everybody down and no armor checks)...I had this weird out-of-body experience as I was suddenly detached from everything I knew about the game. Also, I had only limited toleration for the Jim and Bob commentary going in...I did not want an entire game mode built around the sub-par writing that these two are compelled to read...
4: UI and gameplay are essentially the same as the BETA.
5: MP remains extremely robust. I've got four on-line matches in now with two different teams and no disconnects or other problems. As others have observed, though, no save game means each game is a commitment.
6: It is AWFULLY hard to go from 23 races to eight. I understand the model. I understand the market, but that's a cliff not a decline.
Bottom line: I like it. A lot. Weird, huh? For all its flaws, it has finally got me planning to store my board game and miniatures for good. My son and I are squeezing in matches as often as we can and they are uniformly a good time. I continue to get stomped on-line -- as RPS points out, there's people for whom this has been their game for decades -- so will, once the code settles a bit -- set up a Grogheads league and see if there's any interest...
I'd like to get BB2 but, from the vids I've seen, it needs some additions. Besides more races, which will obviously be DLC'd to the sky.
My main hang-up is some UI bits. While some of the UI is improved, other bits are a step back.
There are no nameplate tags above each player on the field to identify what they are. In a game that uses a turn timer, I want to be sure what something is at a glance without clicking on it.
Similarly, I don't like the new special ability icons laid over the character window. The original's text list was just fine. Again.. you have to interpret the graphic symbol for each (or hover cursor for tooltip?) to know what they are. Not an improvement.
The 'End Turn' button located too far out over the playing field makes accidental clicks when ordering stuff around a constant problem.
The saving mid-game thing, of course.
Just some noticeable bits from watching. I'm sure there are more UI improvements/reversions to be made.
I'd also like to hear how well the race-tailored single player AI performs in a regular (non-prefab) campaign. They still have regular campaigns like BB1, right?
I wouldn't mind their choice of charging of other races, if they priced their core product right - but, imo and more importantly, for me, they haven't.
One small observation re: the names: the figures and their animations are honestly so good, I never had a problem figuring out who was who...I also had no problem with accidental "end game" clicks, but I was using an Xbox controller...
Re: price, i think we all know all it will take is the Holiday sale to solve that for those not willing to take the pain of early adoption.
Quote from: Cyrano on September 23, 2015, 11:33:49 AM
For all its flaws, it has finally got me planning to store my board game and miniatures for good.
I wouldn't sell or store the originals in a place too far away if I were you. If you're anything like me, the glitz of a new computer game will wear and you'll start to want to actually pick up pieces and play in person again eventually. But in case not, want to sell any of your BB mini's?? ;)
For anyone who has this - can you give a run down of what's it's like and what comes "in the package" please?
I really like the BloodBowl game but suck real bad at it. But I could be tempted to "upgrade"
Appreciated, thanks O0
Quote from: JudgeDredd on September 24, 2015, 05:26:37 AM
For anyone who has this - can you give a run down of what's it's like and what comes "in the package" please?
I really like the BloodBowl game but suck real bad at it. But I could be tempted to "upgrade"
Appreciated, thanks O0
Just like the original, but with some UI improvements.... and a few omissions. Reportedly using a new engine with fewer inherent issues. Fewer playable races thus far, though.
There are many things on my 'want' list right now, and not enough funds to get them all. I'm gonna wait for the inevitable stretch of patches and additions to pass before picking up BB2. Probably on a sale or package thing eventually.
I enjoyed the first one, despite a few complaints regarding the programming, so I'm already sold on the gameplay itself.
I hear you - especially about the missing content.
I'll wait for the Christmas sale.