I withdraw my support for RPS and eat a large slice of humble pie

[TacticalWargames]

WOW..talk about washing your laundry in public places..

I don't bother with the RPS forums..just read Flare Path and any articles on games I'm interested in..

[Staggerwing]

WOW..talk about washing your laundry in public places..

Wait, what?  ???

[GDS_Starfury]

please continue.

[TacticalWargames]

Talking about this Zoe business cheating etc etc..seems all abit odd.

[Staggerwing]

Ah, yes. Of course.

[bayonetbrant]

WOW..talk about washing your laundry in public places..

I don't bother with the RPS forums..just read Flare Path and any articles on games I'm interested in..

O0

[Bison]

This has nothing to do with whoever this broad is that you're all talking about and whatever it is she did with her vagina.  I don't know and don't care about that, but this is an epic freaking rant against the stupidity and hypocrisy of the PC and feminist agitators in the media.  Just watch.  Trust me.

[undercovergeek]

This has nothing to do with whoever this broad is that you're all talking about and whatever it is she did with her vagina.  I don't know and don't care about that, but this is an epic freaking rant against the stupidity and hypocrisy of the PC and feminist agitators in the media.  Just watch.  Trust me.

perfect

ive never seen anyone vibrating with the need to shout 'fk you you idiots' so much

[Barthheart]

This has nothing to do with whoever this broad is that you're all talking about and whatever it is she did with her vagina.  I don't know and don't care about that, but this is an epic freaking rant against the stupidity and hypocrisy of the PC and feminist agitators in the media.  Just watch.  Trust me.

So perfect!  O0 

[Huw the Poo]

Hahaha, that was ace!  No wonder it's good - that's Maddox, who made The Best Page in the Universe, a constant source of merriment when he used to update it regularly.

Edit: Oh, looks like he's updating it regularly again.  Cool!

[bayonetbrant]

Greg Costikyan's take

"As a male voice in the game industry," writes my daughter Vicky, "you should speak out about this."

Ouch.

I wanted to hold my tongue. Because when I let loose, it usually does me no favors. But she's right.

WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?

What do you think you're defending? An industry in which greed-head executives make brain-dead games on a yearly basis that show little to no innovation from one title to the next? You fucking -want- Madden? And the next Call of Duty game, same as the last but with new content from hundreds of exploited drones working hours that destroy relationships because the suits think that's what they want?

For decades, we had a market that catered to Maxim-reading horny boy-men who bought games by developers who spent man-years on developing better physics to make tits bounce in the next beach volleyball title. For decades, we had shameless manager jackasses who thought the best way to market their titles was to hire high-breasted bimbos to pose and giggle at their booths at E3.

For decades, we had the best creative minds of our industry SHUT DOWN whenever they proposed the slightest design innovation, because increasing budgets meant all design risk must be minimized.

For decades, we had no way for people who wanted to do anything creative be able to find any path to market.

Finally, finally, and thank god, we have a viable path of market for indies, and a way for people who want to express themselves through games that will never sell in the millions to find a market. And you find that a PROBLEM?

What kind of blinkered idiots you are?

And of course, indies do whatever the fuck they can to get noticed, because they don't have MILLIONS OF MARKETING DOLLARS TO SPEND. What the fuck would you expect?

Let me explain something do you. Bobby Kotick, CEO of Activision: Mutimillionare. Anna Anthrophy? Stroppy indie developer who probably has problems paying her rent. Who has the power here? What the fuck are you talking about?

There's some kind of conspiracy by the in-group to promote indie games at the expense of "real" games? What the fuck are you talking about? Who cares who Zoe Quinn fucked, or didn't fuck? It's none of your fucking business, unless you were one of the people involved, and most of you would give your left kidney to fuck her, if you had any brains. You are unlikely ever to touch anyone with an iota of her talent or intelligence.

And what does that even mean? Have you suddenly noticed that the game industry is undergoing weird changes as a result of this supposed conspiracy? The next Call of Duty being cancelled in favor of triple-A treatment of the next Anna Anthropy design?

Do people who actually care about whether games can be more than degraded violence porn for young men sometimes get together and talk about games that actually matter? And do they sometimes write about such games?

You're fucking right they do! And you should be fucking grateful that someday a more mature and interesting landscape of videogames may emerge from that! That's not what we call "conspiracy;" that's what we call "gamers who care about games."

And what is it with this mysoginistic bullshit?

I want to tell you some stories.

1. The studio head who invited me -and a female employee- to join them at a strip club at a conference, expecting we would all enjoy this as a 'fun time.'

2. The party given by an industry marketing firm where I and Dan Scherlis were approached by a scantily clad woman who was evidently hired to show their clients a good time (not necessarily including actual fornication) and had to explain that we were both involved with people we cared about, and actually were having a perfectly enjoyable time talking to each other.

3. The -very- gay friend of mine who was hired by another firm and started sweating when I approached their booth at a conference, in fear that I would reveal his sexual orientation to his new boss.

4. My friend, Dan Bunten, a seminal figure in early PC gaming, who decided he was a woman, and after extensive surgery, became Danielle Bunten Berry. "Shabbily treated" wouldn't even begin to describe it.

I have no idea why gender and such is even an issue in this conversation. Women have always been a minority in the games industry, to its loss; but they have never been entirely missing. Roberta Williams created the Sierra adventures. Brenda Garno, later Brathwaite, later Romero, was one of the key talents behind the Wizardry series.

If you look at recent IGDA surveys, 80+% of all jobs in the industry are held by men. This is a problem, particularly as industry surveys say that a majority of gamers are women. To be sure, they're playing Candy Crush and not Call of Duty, and maybe that doesn't qualify as a "real game" to you, but if so, fuck off. Games are games, games are good, and it's great that more people are playing them. Stop masturbating with your console controller and get a life.

Anita Sirkeesian has told some pretty obvious truths about the treatment of women in games; controversial ones, and others are free to debate them, but "debate" doesn't normally involve threats to rape or kill.

You can like, or not like, Zoe Quinn's work; tastes vary. But her sex life is not, and never has been, any of your fucking business.

Leigh Alexander is one of the most interesting journalists working in games.

This is bullshit, you are assholes, and shut the fuck up.

Deal with the fact that not all games are, or will be in the future, the same corporate crap that you apparently love so much. And understand that the money-grubbing entities who dole out this crap will continue to feed your fix, because it's a far larger market than is reached by the indie people, whom you despise and spit on, can possibly ever hope to reach.

You're attacking people who have problems making their rent, apparently in defense of people who make millions off your fanboy lusts; and somehow feel threatened by people who love games -- as I supposed you do -- but love games that are a little different.

You are assholes.

Worse, you are poor examples of men. Men, good men, defend women. They do not attack them.

To which end: To defend the honor of Anita Sirkeesian, Zoe Quinn, Leigh Alexander, or yes, Anna Anthropy, I will be willing to meet any of you, on horse or afoot, with sword or pistol, at a time and place of your choosing.

It is time this stopped.

Gamasutra had it on their front page, then pulled it down, supposedly b/c of profanity; but it's still cached
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fgamasutra.com%2Fblogs%2FGregCostikyan%2F20140907%2F225017%2FGamersgate_STFU.php

[MetalDog]

Not involved in any of this, however, I've read the thread from its start.  I gotta say, I don't know the particulars, but that rant is pretty spot on.

[Huw the Poo]

Well I have several major problems with that rant, but I'm about to go to work and don't have much time.  I'll just summarise my main problems briefly:

1. Extremely blinkered.  He thinks that everyone who opposes the SJW agenda has been sending threats to Sarkeesian.  There are so many things wrong with this supposition it's hard to know where to begin, but I can elaborate later for anyone who really needs it.
2. Games will not magically become "better" (itself a very subjective term) if more women work on them.
3. Many women already working in the games industry are disgusted with the SJWs.
4. The writer uses exactly the same flawed logic as Matt Lees had, which is to say that the gaming market has only just become vibrant, recently, thanks to indie.  As point 1...so many things wrong with this it's hard to know where to begin.  Quick hint though: games have always been awesome, but now there's more of them.  Christ, a couple of months ago plenty of people were complaining about the amount of indie shovelware they have to plough through on Steam.  You can't have it both ways!  Quantity does not equal quality.  And we aren't suddenly awash in great games because more women make them for us.
5. Like nearly everyone in this debate, he misuses the word misogyny.
6. Triple A games sell well because it's what people want to play - that's their choice, leave them the fuck alone.
7. The writer clearly holds people like Sarkeesian and Quinn on a pedestal despite the many vile things they've done.  They cannot be touched apparently, and if you dare criticise, to this guy you're a "misogynist" (sic).  That's the biggest problem this debate has had.  He doesn't want to listen to counterarguments and won't let a little thing like fact knock him from his high horse.

I think this guy should go back to shaving his vagina and leave writing to people who know how to do it.

That's just off the top of my head as I get ready to go to work.  Happy to write more later.

[Ian C]

This is all screwed up and that vid above puts it in perspective. All this is, is mob mentality. It's a vent for dissatisfied people to have a bitch at something. But there are more important issues for people to invest their anger in.

How about innocent people getting their heads cut off or people starving in their own countries because of poverty. They should put their frustrations there, where actual people could benefit from it. Not in this crap that sows discontent between people. We are truly living in Bizarro world.

[undercovergeek]

We are truly living in Bizarro world.

without digging very deep, because i literally dont care, there is now a massive storm over the use of the term 'gamer'

such was the tide of vitriol against the ladies in the media from those individuals who cant express themselves without having to resort to mutilation threats or death threats, the backlash from the pro group was 'gamers' are such a bunch of assholes, sites such as RPS mentioned they wanted nothing to do with 'gamers'

and that upset the people who play games, who arent gamers because they dont give a fk if youre a woman, an under represented gay dungeon crawler, or a white knight - they just play games

and theyre rapidly trying to retreat from the gamer people whilst still saying but we play games and boo hooing to RPS because RPS basically said all our readership are c**ts

i have never seen anything like it in my life - its hilarious, its hard to convey here in a world of 'normal' (using the term very loosely!) that out there are vast numbers of people tearing their hair out at the mention of the term gamer, that a gaming website has said we dont like gamers, and theyre still arguing over who slept with who and how that has tarnished news feeds and reviews of games