Justice to investigate Spring Valley incident

[Swatter]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/sheriff-asks-fbi-us-justice-department-to-investigate-spring-valley-incident/ar-BBmt9jX?ocid=spartandhp

Thoughts?

[bayonetbrant]

Leon Lott doesn't dick around.  If he called the Feds in to investigate, there's a reason.  I used to live in Richland County, and he was a no-nonsense, no-politics kind of guy.  He just wanted to do his job, and keep people safe.  He started up a county-wide undercover anti-shoplifting program over Thanksgiving weekends that cut theft over that weekend about 60-70% over the course of 3-4 years or so.

[LongBlade]

Good for him. That's quite impressive.

[Swatter]

Leon Lott doesn't dick around.  If he called the Feds in to investigate, there's a reason.  I used to live in Richland County, and he was a no-nonsense, no-politics kind of guy.  He just wanted to do his job, and keep people safe.  He started up a county-wide undercover anti-shoplifting program over Thanksgiving weekends that cut theft over that weekend about 60-70% over the course of 3-4 years or so.

I'm not sure. From the video, it looks brutal, but I don't see anything to indicate outside investigators would be needed. It is a case of potential improper use of force that didn't even require hospitalization. Why would outside investigators be needed (other than for political purposes)? At worst, we are looking at a suspension or termination. I don't think any criminal charges are realistically possible.

What I would like to see the media discuss (after 2 years of heightened scrutiny of police) is exactly what a person's rights and responsibilities are when involved with the police. In this case, the student was actively resisting arrest. Citizens have a legal obligation to follow lawful police commands. If a person physically resists arrest, the officer is trained to use a level of force greater than is being used by the resistor. Once a person is placed under arrest, you will be arrested one way or another and the police will not ask nicely (nor should they).

Its hard to say what is exactly going on in the video. I would imagine some sort of arm bar could have removed the student from her chair, but that would have been brutal also. When a person resists arrest, there will be no happy ending. The police will kick your butt. I would agree that the violence showed could be excessive, but the media and others are going way overboard here.

[Steelgrave]

Two things.

(1) I see no reason for and don't understand why the feds need to be involved so soon. The cop answers to his department, if the department's response is deemed insufficient then the Feds could move in as has happened before.

(2) The video....I see another badge-heavy bully using excessive force that just happens to be caught on camera. I'm sure this is not going to be a popular viewpoint, but a badge doesn't give you the right to kick ass and take names unless the circumstances demand it, which clearly was not the case here. The "if they did what the cop said" argument is old and tired, considering the numerous videos online where they were doing exactly what the officer said but still ended up being brutalized. I come from long lines of peace officers and raised my children to respect the law, but I've also personally known dirty cops, so wearing the badge is never a "once size fits all" situation.

The bottom line? The police will win back the public's respect when they start policing themselves better, which Lott seems to be attempting. Cops decry the code of silence which exists in many neighborhoods, but the same officers are quick to close ranks when one of their own crosses the line. "Snitches get stiches" isn't just a ghetto slogan, they simply call it something different in blue.

[bayonetbrant]

To your point #1, the department called in the feds, not someone else

[Steelgrave]

To your point #1, the department called in the feds, not someone else

I understood that. I could have made that more clear in my response. Thanks for the clarification, BB.

[LongBlade]

I suppose he called in the feds because he wanted the issue to remain apolitical.

The office of sheriff is probably elected. This passes all responsibility out of his (potentially) political hands.

I'm still quite impressed with his impact on shoplifting. That's very cool.

[bayonetbrant]

No prob. I figured you knew, but just making sure. Like I said, he was out sheriff when we lived down there, and one of his dispatchers was one of my best friends in the SCARNG. He's not one to play politics. He just wants to get shit done

LB: he is elected

[Steelgrave]

No prob. I figured you knew, but just making sure. Like I said, he was out sheriff when we lived down there, and one of his dispatchers was one of my best friends in the SCARNG. He's not one to play politics. He just wants to get shit done

LB: he is elected

Love to see more like him then. Appreciate your sharing your personal knowledge, BB. We have a good sheriff here in Oklahoma County as well. Of course, I spent the six years prior in Maricopa County, Arizona where the only Dem I voted for was whoever ran against Sheriff Arpaio.

[bayonetbrant]

Here's a note from someone on FB with a little more local intel

Fellow students in the class that were interviewed said "The teacher asked the girl to get off her phone, she refused, she was told to leave the class and refused, school administrators asked her to leave the class because she was on her phone and she continued to refuse, the School Resource Officer asked her to leave the room and she still refused, and it resulted in her and one other student being physically removed from class.
Other students reported " He asked her nicely to get up, over and over he did nothing wrong. They asked her to get up but she wanted to show off, To some it looks bad but she wanted to prove she was bad."
The Teacher was asked if he felt bad for what happened to her? his reply: "She should have cooperated."

[Steelgrave]

CNN is reporting Sheriff Lott as saying the student struck the officer after he put his hands on her to get her out of her chair. The Sheriff is still considering what action to take against the officer, in part because of  the "troubled history" of the officer in question and the fact that the incident still escalated beyond reasonable force in the eyes of Lott. I stand by my stated opinion about the increased incidents of police brutality and overreaction which have come to our attention because everyone has a camera now, but striking a cop in any fashion is crossing the line and volunteering to get your ass kicked.

[LongBlade]

Here's a note from someone on FB with a little more local intel

Fellow students in the class that were interviewed said "The teacher asked the girl to get off her phone, she refused, she was told to leave the class and refused, school administrators asked her to leave the class because she was on her phone and she continued to refuse, the School Resource Officer asked her to leave the room and she still refused, and it resulted in her and one other student being physically removed from class.
Other students reported " He asked her nicely to get up, over and over he did nothing wrong. They asked her to get up but she wanted to show off, To some it looks bad but she wanted to prove she was bad."
The Teacher was asked if he felt bad for what happened to her? his reply: "She should have cooperated."

How difficult is it to be nice these days? Someone asks you to get off your phone in class - get off!

Officer Friendly comes in and asks you to leave the room - leave the room!

This isn't rocket science.

[Steelgrave]

I don't think Officer Friendly was on duty that day.......Officer Steroids perhaps, but I agree that compliance is generally the best policy.

[mirth]

Well at least he didn't shoot her.  ::)