Panther Games Command Ops 2 Limited Time Offer Bundle Pack Coming Soon

[-budd-]

getting the commander pack within the 90 days for 49.99 is a no brainer if you have any interest in the game.. Looks like the regular price after 90 days is $159.95

http://lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=72

[JudgeDredd]

Absolutely.

I let my previous versions go for charity - so I'll be getting these.

[TacticalWargames]

I really hoped the next version of CO would have had mounted Ops and be the East front game...oh well..though I have all the releases I will buy this aswell.

[Grim.Reaper]

I was just looking around at the new store page for the core game and modules and looked at the page concerning the core engine itself....was a little puzzled on what it said.  I bolded the part below that puzzled me where it says "Free for a Limited Time!"....I had thought the whole new pricing model was based on getting the core engine always free, while we had to pay to only for upgrades to all of our module content.  This seems to imply that at some point we will also have to pay for the core engine itself on top of the modules, which then doesn't seem like anything different from when it was at Matrix.  Although I like the game series and really was looking forward to getting more deep into it with the next version being released on Monday, I don't know if I can keep re-buying a new core version and all my same content that I previously bought each time a new version comes up.

http://lnlpublishing.com/command-ops-2-core-engine

Free for a Limited Time!
The Core engine provides the Command Ops 2 game application which has been extensively updated with a new user interface (UI) and enhanced artificial intelligence (AI). The smartest and most realistic operational level wargame just got a whole lot better. Command like a real commander in this pausable, continuous time simulation of WW2 operational warfare, where the emphasis is on planning, anticipating and reacting to enemy developments. This is not a click-fest and you don't have to issue orders to every unit. The world's smartest operational level AI can be trusted to do a reasonable job of managing your forces. Also included are the editors ( MapMaker, EstabMaker, EstabEditor and ScenMaker ) for modifying or developing your own scenarios. The Core comes with three scenarios, including the tutorial Return to St Vith, Manhay Crossroads and Greyhound Dash, all focussed on the epic 1944 Battle of the Bulge.

[Pete Dero]

It looks a bit more complicated :

http://forums.lnlpublishing.com/threads/command-ops-2-limited-time-offer-bundle-pack-coming-soon.998/page-3


If this is the case I will spend in one year:
0$ CO2.0
50$ data pack
50$ CO 2.1
50$ updated data pack
50$ CO 2.2
50$ updated data pack

So 250$ per year to constantly be up to date with your game. Is this right?

No there will be no charge for the updates to the engine. The engine will always be free. You only pay to buy or upgrade data modules. If we put out a major upgrade to the engine then you will need to upgrade your data modules if you want to run them with the latest engine. But you are not obliged to upgrade your data modules. You can instead use the older version of the engine to run them.

Example. in the next twelve months we plan to put out CO2.0 and CO2.1 as major updates to the engine. If you want to keep your data modules up to date with each engine update then you will pay $50 to update them to 2.0 and another $50 for 2.1 - ie a total of $100. We plan to put out the KOAD and Westwall data modules in the first half of next year at $30 each. Subject to when we finish the 2.1 engine update with mounted ops feature we plan to then release one maybe two east front modules. Let's assume we achieve that, then the most you would spend in the next twelve months would be $100 for updates plus $120 for new data modules. That's a total of $220. In effect you will have acquired five new data modules (Med, KOAD, Westwall East Front 1 and East Front 2). If we had sold each as a separate game then you would have paid something in the order of $250 and you would have not been able to play all your scenarios with the latest engine.

I would like to reiterate this point. You don't have to upgrade all or some of your data with each engine update. You could for instance opt to delay purchasing the 2.1 upgrade for instance till the 2.2 update comes out. Then you could buy the new modules for it and those for the earlier 2.1 update. This would save you $50.

[Al]

Hmmm, given that information and for a game that I probably won't ever play that much it might not be worth it to spring for the initial pack...if I want to keep it up to date, that is.  After all, I have all the originals and they seem to work fine.   :-\

[JudgeDredd]

It amazes me sometimes why there seems to be this desire nowadays to make something more convoluted than it has to be.

So if I buy the command ops pack tomorrow...it's a lot of game for the price. But when a major upgrade comes out, I'm $50 for the upgrade - and each upgrade after...if I wanted? And also for modules?

What if I don't buy the 2.1 upgrade....when it gets to 3.0 and I think "Those changes are worth it"...do I have to buy each upgrade between 2.1 and 3.0 or can I just upgrade to 3.0? 

[panzerde]

This just went from a Day One buy for me to "wait and see if they come to their senses." $220 to $250 per year to keep this game updated? 

[sandman2575]

This makes Battlefront's pricing model seem perfectly reasonable by comparison.
You have to repay full price for every update?

I know this is a small, independent publisher, but this sounds simply crazy.

[panzerde]

Well, I actually probably will be it right away just to get the bundle pricing - I don't want to end up getting stuck for even more money down the line to get this. Nonetheless I think their pricing model is hopelessly broken.

[Staggerwing]

One could spring for the special pricing now and hope that the prices for the upgrades go down or go on sale a lot a la Digital Combat Simulator.

[Cyrano]

Wait, what?

Wow...just wow.  I love these guys and their games, but that's completely twitter-pated.  Quite honestly, this almost makes me angry it's so ridiculous...and one ought never get angry about a game you haven't spent money on.

Glad I kept my Matrix versions...

Best,

Jim
"Cyrano"
:/7)

[panzerde]

This makes Battlefront's pricing model seem perfectly reasonable by comparison.
You have to repay full price for every update?

I know this is a small, independent publisher, but this sounds simply crazy.

Reading in the thread on the LnL forums, it sound like they intend to do some bundle upgrade pricing for all of the modules you own, capped at $50. So, to stay current at two major engine updates a year puts you at $100 if I'm understanding it correctly. Better, but that's still $100 just to stay current.New modules are going to add $30 per on top of that.

This is excused by saying "upgrading is optional and up to you." Except, of course you won't be able to play new content if you don't upgrade the engine, and who wants to keep multiple versions of the engine around to play the content packs you didn't upgrade and the new content packs using newer versions of the engine?

It's certainly a different approach. I'm someone that doesn't complain about Matrix or Battlefront pricing, and even I think this is nuts. If you're scaring me off, you're scaring off your core market.

[JasonPratt]

There is certainly confusion in the marketing at least. What does "Free for a limited time" mean if the core engine is always free but nothing else is free? What the hell is left over to be free for a limited time??

And if the core engine is always free, and only the data packs cost anything -- which seems like a reasonable model to start with anyway, the core functions as the demo, pay what you want to play with beyond that -- then why should there be charges for updating the core engine?

And what exactly is being paid for in data pack updates? If it's extensive new scenarios that's one thing. If it's fixing bugs in the engine as they come to light from further playing...

:'(

I love Panther Games, and I do want them to succeed and thrive, and snagging the opening package is still on my things to do tomorrow (or asap next week, whatever), but this is a major blow to my confidence going forward. "No, keeping updated for the year won't cost you $250, only $220, see?" uh.... that's... that's not significantly any better... "Okay how about $100 a year just to stay current on the content you already have, not for new content? That's what we mean. Just remember it's free for a limited time!"

It's certainly a different approach. I'm someone that doesn't complain about Matrix or Battlefront pricing, and even I think this is nuts. If you're scaring me off, you're scaring off your core market.

QFT

[Grim.Reaper]

My reason for posting in the first place was because it seems like the core engine might be a fee at some point, which is different then what was said at the start that justified charging for all the modules.  Now it looks like we might not be just charged for modules, but for both some day.  I was ok paying for the modules if the engine was free because I justified it in my mind that I would typically be paying for the core upgrade of other products anyway, so I thought it would be a wash especially if the module bundle was $50 (typical cost of a game like this).  But if another fee gets put on top, then I am not so sure.

Either way, I'll be buying this first bundle, just not sure about the future.  I agree with JD, not sure why they needed to over complicate things, you know its crazy when it takes a lot of discussion for people to understand exactly what the pricing policy is....shouldn't be that hard.  As I said earlier with the delays, I really don't see a lot different happening with this new company, compared to the old company....hopefully just growing pains.