GrogHeads Forum

Game site (http://www.endlesspace.com/)



Damn, these space strategy games seem to be springing up all over the place lately (not that I'm complaining)! 

I just found out about this 4x title courtesy of Adam Solo over at Space Sector (article here (http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/03/endless-space-a-new-4x-space-game-by-amplitude-games/)), although apparently original credit goes to Ashbery over at the old site.  I like the apparent emphasis on exploration, and the "hero system" (different classes, unique ability trees, etc.) sounds very cool as well.  Of course, it looks good too, which never hurts. 

Sounds promising...and thanks for pointing me to Space Sector. Lots of great stuff here for us space strategy grogs. :)

Oh yeah, and there's a fairly extensive thread (http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?23-Design-Overview) going over the game's design. 

Quote from: Shelldrake on March 07, 2012, 07:39:08 PM
Sounds promising...and thanks for pointing me to Space Sector. Lots of great stuff here for us space strategy grogs. :)

You're welcome!  Yeah, I visit Space Sector frequently. 

Wow this one looks really polished...and almost in beta! The last three games you posted all look like definite buys for me Martok. You're on a roll!

Martok is to space gaming what Jarhead is to heavy artillery  ;D

That is awesome!  I think we truly are in the golden age of 4x space games.  Now if we could just revive the ailing flight sim genre....

Will keep an eye out for it.

And damn, there sure are a hell lot of 4X games coming out all the time lately.

Quote from: Gusington on March 07, 2012, 09:05:13 PM
Wow this one looks really polished...and almost in beta! The last three games you posted all look like definite buys for me Martok. You're on a roll!

Thanks!  Honestly, though, I just happen to have gotten lucky thus far.  I generally only post about space strategy games I'm truly interested in -- note that I don't discuss Sword of the Stars or Sins of a Solar Empire much -- and it's just so worked out that all of the ones I've mentioned seem to have a fairly wide appeal (in addition to them also appearing to already be in a playable state). 

Quote from: Steelgrave on March 07, 2012, 11:43:57 PM
Martok is to space gaming what Jarhead is to heavy artillery  ;D

Well we all have our fetishes.  ;) 

Quote from: Tpek on March 08, 2012, 08:52:34 AM
And damn, there sure are a hell lot of 4X games coming out all the time lately.

Indeed.  As republic said -- and has said elsewhere -- I think *now* may be the "halcyon days" of the 4x genre, as opposed to 15 years ago.  It's a good time to be a space strategy gamer! 

All - Gamersgate is having a space game sale, strategy and sims. You have been warned.

A lot of the Evochron games on sale...this may make me finally take the plunge on one!

Quote from: Gusington on March 08, 2012, 03:24:15 PM
All - Gamersgate is having a space game sale, strategy and sims. You have been warned.

A lot of the Evochron games on sale...this may make me finally take the plunge on one!

I am tempted to. Tell me your impressions of Evechron mercenary. Preferably soonish... :D

Quote from: Fetrik on March 08, 2012, 03:26:21 PM
I am tempted to. Tell me your impressions of Evechron mercenary. Preferably soonish... :D

I own Evochron Mercenary.  Its a fun game and there are a few dedicated to multiplayer.  I consider it a must own.  I don't play it often, but when I do I always enjoy myself.  It really captures the essence of speed in space combat I think.

From what I understand there is a huge update/expansion on the horizon to make planets bigger etc.

Quote from: republic on March 08, 2012, 03:55:43 PM

Quote from: Fetrik on March 08, 2012, 03:26:21 PM
I am tempted to. Tell me your impressions of Evechron mercenary. Preferably soonish... :D

I own Evochron Mercenary.  Its a fun game and there are a few dedicated to multiplayer.  I consider it a must own.  I don't play it often, but when I do I always enjoy myself.  It really captures the essence of speed in space combat I think.

From what I understand there is a huge update/expansion on the horizon to make planets bigger etc.

Awww... Now i feel almost forced to buy it! I was thinking screw the sale and i'll pick it up when i am good and ready to sink my teeth into it. That way i would most likely have not bought it at all.
Sucks when my plans backfire...

Damn you Republic now I feel I must get it!

I need to qualify my statement a bit, I enjoy the game because its an amazing space simulator.  The ability to fly to planets seemlessly etc.  However, the reason I don't play often is you have to make your own story.  Its a sandbox (similar to X3) and you go and play.

The music and atmosphere are amazing, but once you get all the tech items in the game it can be redundant.

Having said all that, I paid full price for it on launch and do not feel cheated  :)

Seriously, you guys need to check out the features & design on this game.  The devs have posted an impressive amount of info so far; for an example, see this thread (http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?112-Galaxy-Generation-and-Player-Start) on galaxy generation (the posts about the different types of planets, resources, & anomalies in particular caught my attention). 

Also, the amount of lore & background story they've created for Endless Space is wonderfully ridiculous (see this thread (http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?22-The-Universe)).  These guys definitely don't believe in half-assing anything! 

Just tell me which one is better than Sins of a Solar Empire

As far as I'm concerned, all of them.  But then I'm not a Sins fan. 

http://www.endlesspace.com/Progress

That page is genius!  I don't know why more developers don't do something like this.  I get so tired of developers keeping everything under wraps until release, and on the converse giving false hope and too much 'marketing' information.  This progress page is perfect, you know where they are and what they are working on.

Quote from: republic on March 19, 2012, 06:46:45 PM
http://www.endlesspace.com/Progress

That page is genius!  I don't know why more developers don't do something like this.  I get so tired of developers keeping everything under wraps until release, and on the converse giving false hope and too much 'marketing' information.  This progress page is perfect, you know where they are and what they are working on.

Part of the reason they are doing it this way is due to their participation in a communal development effort, this Games2gether thing. I don't know much about it, but it looks like you can subsidize the game or, if you are an artist and such, offer your services to help out specific parts of the development.

Quote from: republic on March 19, 2012, 06:46:45 PM
http://www.endlesspace.com/Progress

That page is genius!  I don't know why more developers don't do something like this.  I get so tired of developers keeping everything under wraps until release, and on the converse giving false hope and too much 'marketing' information.  This progress page is perfect, you know where they are and what they are working on.

I've seen a lot of other devs do that TBH.
Except they actually sometimes update those figures :D

fyi:  Space Sector just published an interview with the designers:

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/03/interview-with-amplitude-studios-on-endless-space/

Yeah, the devs mentioned it on their forums.  That interview is my next stop once I'm done here.  :) 

Looks like they'll be taking pre-orders starting next week.

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/04/endless-space-pre-orders-next-week/


"There will be 2 different pre-order versions (or packages) available:

An Admiral Edition (29.90€ /$~$40 with 25% off till May 31st) that includes "access to Alpha and all upcoming versions including the final version of the game, an OST, and community bonuses" [anyone know what an OST is? Doh, that would be an "official sound track"]

a special edition called Emperor Special Edition (34.90€/~$46 with 25% off till May 31st)
which from what I could tell is a fan kit package, for folks that want to be more actively involved in the game's development process, as the devs put it, to " help us feel confident on the game's success, which can be an amazing moral boost for the whole team".

p.s. With the 25% discount, the prices come out to be:

22.49€/~$30 for the Admiral Edition
26.24€/~$35 for the Emperor Special Edition

Fantastic. Definitely buying it. Not sure which version though.

Me either.

Here is a link to their forums with some additional info on the two options as well as the minimum/recommended specs

http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?210-News-from-the-Dev-Team&p=4867&viewfull=1#post4867

Kinda worried if my 2.66GHz Core2 quad will be able to handle it well enough  :-\

In a quick glance I didn't see any mention of the game's optimization, but fingers crossed.

I'll play a late beta but an alpha build??? At any rate, it will be a source of revenue to help them finish it up I suppose. Looks like a great game and we can always use more 4x games.

Quote from: steve58 on April 27, 2012, 09:46:53 AM
Looks like they'll be taking pre-orders starting next week.

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/04/endless-space-pre-orders-next-week/


"There will be 2 different pre-order versions (or packages) available:

An Admiral Edition (29.90€ /$~$40 with 25% off till May 31st) that includes "access to Alpha and all upcoming versions including the final version of the game, an OST, and community bonuses" [anyone know what an OST is? Doh, that would be an "official sound track"]

a special edition called Emperor Special Edition (34.90€/~$46 with 25% off till May 31st)
which from what I could tell is a fan kit package, for folks that want to be more actively involved in the game's development process, as the devs put it, to " help us feel confident on the game's success, which can be an amazing moral boost for the whole team".

p.s. With the 25% discount, the prices come out to be:

22.49€/~$30 for the Admiral Edition
26.24€/~$35 for the Emperor Special Edition

Must...resist...urge...to pull...trigger... 

^Get it...the game wants you to buy it.

If I'm going to become a Steam whore, then I'm at least going to wait until there are multiple games ready for purchase.  (So Endless Space, Warlock: Master of the Arcane, a Shogun 2: Complete Edition -- you know they'll have one at some point -- etc.) 

That way I can just douse myself so thoroughly in gaming goodness that I can forget my shame at selling out for at least a little while... 

Just a heads up, it is available on Steam right now.
Pre-purchase is supposed to grant immediate alpha access.

 :( Checking this forum always seems to cost me money.  Thanks!

I noticed that today and was looking for this thread to post.  I will probably jump in on the alpha tonight.  I'm such a sucker for space 4x.

Space Sector has a first look at the alpha:  http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/05/endless-space-alpha-first-look-preview/.

I'm going to look this over and then probably pre-order the Admiral Edition.  I don't fancy having my face on a wall in Paris ;)

Quote from: steve58 on April 27, 2012, 09:46:53 AM
Looks like they'll be taking pre-orders starting next week.

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/04/endless-space-pre-orders-next-week/

p.s. With the 25% discount, the prices come out to be:

22.49€/~$30 for the Admiral Edition
26.24€/~$35 for the Emperor Special Edition

Interestingly Steam's pre-order prices are showing as

$22.49 for the Admiral Edition
$26.24 for the Emperor Special Edition

Maybe I'll have to get the Emperor Edition after all....

Quote from: steve58 on May 02, 2012, 04:40:10 PM

Quote from: steve58 on April 27, 2012, 09:46:53 AM
Looks like they'll be taking pre-orders starting next week.

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/04/endless-space-pre-orders-next-week/

p.s. With the 25% discount, the prices come out to be:

22.49€/~$30 for the Admiral Edition
26.24€/~$35 for the Emperor Special Edition

Interestingly Steam's pre-order prices are showing as

$22.49 for the Admiral Edition
$26.24 for the Emperor Special Edition

Maybe I'll have to get the Emperor Edition after all....

I believe Steam has the game currently on a "sale".
In any case, the price in Euros is probably for Europeans (Steam loves charging Europeans in Euros rather than in USD).

Dammit...*cracks open wallet*

Quote from: Gusington on May 02, 2012, 07:07:53 PM
Dammit...*cracks open wallet*

shouldn't you be showering the flower of your life with some of that????

Maybe a little bling to say "thank you for letting me motorboat on you"

^She's sitting next to me right now and the chest ponies look spectacular!

*bling tossed*

Quote from: Gusington on May 02, 2012, 09:43:59 PM
^She's sitting next to me right now and the chest ponies look spectacular!

*bling tossed*

you are just like me..... too easy!

Those of you who play the alpha/beta, please share with us your thoughts & impressions.  I think this game may make me give up my Steam "virginity" for good, but I want to know I'm not giving it up if it's just going to leave me the next morning!  (Sorry for the tortured metaphor...) 

Quote from: Martok on May 03, 2012, 05:59:43 AM
Those of you who play the alpha/beta, please share with us your thoughts & impressions.  I think this game may make me give up my Steam "virginity" for good, but I want to know I'm not giving it up if it's just going to leave me the next morning!  (Sorry for the tortured metaphor...)

,,,, and leave you something unforgetable in the process...

It was just a matter of time before you broke Martok.

I see that the release date is 'Summer.' Anyone know anything more specific?

Watched the trailer and am jonesing even more now.

The Alpha that is available plays more like a Beta.  All that is missing is multi-player, and three playable races. Of course there are balance issues to be addressed, as well as tightening up the code.  But it's much more playable and feature complete than Alphas that were released as finished product at twice the cost <cough>SoTS2<cough>.

I had time to play a couple of turns and look at the tutorial screens - but based on that very brief time, I'm liking what I see. I guess you can only play as human, and can't select random races to play against, but I chalk that up to it being an alpha.

Quote from: tgb on May 03, 2012, 10:13:57 AM
The Alpha that is available plays more like a Beta.  All that is missing is multi-player, and three playable races. Of course there are balance issues to be addressed, as well as tightening up the code.  But it's much more playable and feature complete than Alphas that were released as finished product at twice the cost <cough>SoTS2<cough>.

I had time to play a couple of turns and look at the tutorial screens - but based on that very brief time, I'm liking what I see. I guess you can only play as human, and can't select random races to play against, but I chalk that up to it being an alpha.

That is great news! I booted up the alpha because I thought I was pre-ordering and then Steam started downloading something, so I wanted to see what it downloaded. But I didn't get a chance to play yet. I went ahead with the Emperor's edition, as it was like $4 more, but I don't exactly know what that means.

Quote from: tgb on May 03, 2012, 10:13:57 AM
The Alpha that is available plays more like a Beta.  All that is missing is multi-player, and three playable races. Of course there are balance issues to be addressed, as well as tightening up the code.  But it's much more playable and feature complete than Alphas that were released as finished product at twice the cost <cough>SoTS2<cough>.

+1

That is awesome tgb. +2

For a measly 25.00 I may as well take the plunge eh?

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 02, 2012, 04:11:49 PM
I noticed that today and was looking for this thread to post.  I will probably jump in on the alpha tonight.  I'm such a sucker for space 4x.

The fact that Steam told me that you already were in was a deciding factor for my pre-order.

StrategyCore also has a preview out: http://www.strategycore.co.uk/articles/previews/endless-space-preview/.  I'd love to have some time to take my copy out for a spin, but real life/work keeps getting in the way.  Maybe this weekend....

Quote from: son_of_montfort on May 03, 2012, 11:24:35 AM

The fact that Steam told me that you already were in was a deciding factor for my pre-order.

Hopefully we will fair better than we did with SOTSII.

I've played this game for an hour and a half now and got to say:
This hardly feels like an Alpha, or even an early Beta (repeating what others said in this thread).
Not a single bug (not to mention crash) found, game is really a lot of fun as well!

God %@^#*...now I have to go spend more money...and with Port Royale 3 coming out tommorow.

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 02:09:17 PM
God %@^#*...now I have to go spend more money...and with Port Royale 3 coming out tommorow.

That was totally off my radar. Please tell us how it is.

Dammit...payday is a week away....

but the chance to play a 4x with the Groggy community...too great an opportunity to pass up...... frak

AND I just re-bought Thief 3. Buy two games in one day?? What is the world coming to? There have been years in which I haven't bought two games :)

New Golden Age?

Quote from: Gusington on May 03, 2012, 02:20:05 PM
AND I just re-bought Thief 3. Buy two games in one day?? What is the world coming to? There have been years in which I haven't bought two games :)

You've clearly never been to a gaming con.

Quote from: Gusington on May 03, 2012, 02:20:05 PM
AND I just re-bought Thief 3. Buy two games in one day?? What is the world coming to? There have been years in which I haven't bought two games :)

New Golden Age?

Ponies Gussy! Ponies!!

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 03, 2012, 01:09:21 PM

Quote from: son_of_montfort on May 03, 2012, 11:24:35 AM

The fact that Steam told me that you already were in was a deciding factor for my pre-order.

Hopefully we will fair better than we did with SOTSII.

BTW, did that game ever release?  ;)

There are the ponies to think about, yes...but 9.99 and then 26.99 is far cheaper than a night spent with the ponies :)

Going over to Steam now for Endless Space...YEEHAW

Quote from: LongBlade on May 03, 2012, 02:10:23 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 02:09:17 PM
God %@^#*...now I have to go spend more money...and with Port Royale 3 coming out tommorow.

That was totally off my radar. Please tell us how it is.

Cant by it tomorrow now...money tight. I will advise as soon as I grab it. I imagine that if you liked PR 2, you'll like this, if you were one of those"WTF is this?" people with PR2, there will be nothing new.

Stupid endless space and its stupid demo.....grmphhhhh

^HAHAHA yeah baby

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 03:13:41 PM

Quote from: LongBlade on May 03, 2012, 02:10:23 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 02:09:17 PM
God %@^#*...now I have to go spend more money...and with Port Royale 3 coming out tommorow.

That was totally off my radar. Please tell us how it is.

Cant by it tomorrow now...money tight. I will advise as soon as I grab it. I imagine that if you liked PR 2, you'll like this, if you were one of those"WTF is this?" people with PR2, there will be nothing new.

Ever thought of writing reviews? =)

...so I've said the heck with work/RL for the day and have been playing around with this a bit.  Was just checking the Endless Space forums and saw that there is an alpha user manual that is downloadable.  Not sure if you'll be able to access it if you didn't buy yet, but here is the link:

http://cdn.steampowered.com/Manuals/208140/Endless%20Space%20User%20Manual%20Alpha.pdf?t=1336004252

^I was just reading through that myself. Pretty deep game.

Quote from: Martok on May 03, 2012, 05:59:43 AM
Those of you who play the alpha/beta, please share with us your thoughts & impressions.  I think this game may make me give up my Steam "virginity" for good, but I want to know I'm not giving it up if it's just going to leave me the next morning!  (Sorry for the tortured metaphor...)

You lost your virginity to Steam with Empire Total War.  Once it's been done, it can never be undone.  I don't think there is a concept of "just the tip" in regard to Steam.

So... I just spent an hour playing this...

Jarhead was right, this game is way more polished as an alpha than most beta tests. There are still some things that scream alpha and lots that needs tweaking or balancing, but overall this is the most fun I've had playing an alpha since... well... Dwarf Fortress (that is sort of a joke).

The game is sort of an amalgamation of different 4X games. The strategic map is a lot like MOO2, although you don't have all that annoying micromanagement of building improvements on every single planet. Instead, improvements are system wide - a really good model, IMHO - you still get the feeling you can customize or specialize your systems without needing to create giant build lists every time you colonize. The tech tree is fairly normal for a tech tree, but I think it is nicely laid out and pretty. Ship creation is a lot like GalCiv 2 (without the lego blocks) as you decide what levels of missile/beam/kinetic you want and then outfit the ship with a few modifying ship pieces (general stuff, like +20% attack/-20% to ship health). You also have the rock, paper, scissors of missile blocked by flak, beam blocked by shields, kinetic blocked by deflector.

Combat is sort of strange. It is completely hands off, except for choosing certain combat cards that alter your ship's stats or do certain effects. You can research and acquire more combat cards as you go along. Despite how that sounds, it is still pretty interesting. The special effects are nice as well.

The game is suffering from a small lack of feedback and information (particularly about all the resources you can get from different planets). But I think this is part of the alpha stage. I did not have much experience in the way of diplomacy and seeing other races - my starting location was broken off from the rest of the galaxy by a wormhole (you need special tech to go through them).

Once this gets more firmed up, I'll write up an official preview or something (unless someone else beats me to it). I think this one has potential! And yes, even as an alpha this one is better than SotS2.

Quote from: LongBlade on May 03, 2012, 03:26:06 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 03:13:41 PM

Quote from: LongBlade on May 03, 2012, 02:10:23 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 03, 2012, 02:09:17 PM
God %@^#*...now I have to go spend more money...and with Port Royale 3 coming out tommorow.

That was totally off my radar. Please tell us how it is.

Cant by it tomorrow now...money tight. I will advise as soon as I grab it. I imagine that if you liked PR 2, you'll like this, if you were one of those"WTF is this?" people with PR2, there will be nothing new.

Ever thought of writing reviews? =)

i think i maybe first then - 23:26 thursday night here in Blighty and im waiting, although i read somewhere it will be 18:00 UK time tomorrow its released - just enough time to put undercover junior to bed, crack open the teapot and set sail on the high seas!

ill bash at it for 60 mins and come back here with some thoughts if thats ok

Quote from: Bison on May 03, 2012, 04:52:27 PM
Once it's been done, it can never be undone.

I hear the Japanese have developed a technique to rebuild virginal barriers.

^ That's true... but not with Steam. It's like Pandora's box... err.... maybe not the best thing to say after your comment... I don't even know Pandora!

I am LOVING this game. Based on an hour playing as the Horatio's(?), who excel in diplomacy and exploration, and are best suited to a Wonder victory. Planet/system development is deep, and the "keyword finder" in the tech tree is one of those "How come no one ever did this before?" features.

Here's how it works. You settle a planet with the luxury resource "Unobtanium", which confers all kinds of bonuses to your faction. But you can't get the bonus until you research "Phony-baloney element mining" (thanks, tool-tips). Going to the tech tree, you input "Phony-baloney element mining" into the finder, and it not only takes you right to the tech, but clicking on it queues up all the prerequisite techs as well (ala Civ). No muss, no fuss.

One more thing. One criticism is that there is no list of colonizable planets. The main screen shows you how many colonizable planets there are in each system, as well as where luxury resources can be found (like strategic resources in Civ V, researching the right tech reveals the locations).

Ships move towards their destination immediately instead of waiting until you hit "next turn". I think that's because ships have a "sensor range" that can reveal surprises. In my current game I keep running into the same "unknown fleet", but can't figure out how to make contact, nor do any other races show up in the diplomacy screen.

Unless there is some tremendous flaw that hasn't cropped up, I would call this the best SF 4X game in a very, very long time.

^Wow. WOW!

How does everyone feel about the combat?

la la la la la.... I can't hear you saying how great this game is.... la la la la la......

Quote from: Kushan on May 03, 2012, 09:28:40 PM
How does everyone feel about the combat?

Now the game takes a while to "ramp up", so my combat experience was light. This is certainly a game where the battle is won before the forces enter the battlefield, in many ways. If you know your opponent is heavy on beams, then you need to focus on shields and make sure to hit them hard in the long-range combat (before beam damage is optimized and missiles are strongest) or mitigate medium range combat (where beams have a bonus) with a good card, then blast them with kinetics in melee combat (kinetics are strongest in melee). Surprisingly, I was very entertained, even though the choices are fairly small. As you improve your tech, you will get more interesting combat cards, so my thought is that it gets more interesting as time goes on. It certainly isn't as satisfying as MoO2's TBS grid, but few games have capture the fun of that style of combat.

Thanks for the impressions fellas. It looks like Steam is going to get some more of my $.  :)

jesus my bank card never saw May coming!!!!!

just so i get this right - its perfectly playable, its a game.... to buy, that everyone thinks is cool but not actually released yet?

and its good?

I'm holding out for an alternative to Steam, but sooner or later, I will buy this game.  Thanks for the impressions so far guys.

Ugh.  You f***ers are making it awfully hard to resist getting this.  Must...hold...on... 

Quote from: Bison on May 03, 2012, 04:52:27 PM
You lost your virginity to Steam with Empire Total War.  Once it's been done, it can never be undone.  I don't think there is a concept of "just the tip" in regard to Steam.

We all have our comforting illusions, Bison. 

Besides, I was slipped a roofie, so ETW doesn't count as far as I'm concerned... 

^Sorry about that but you had to at least try ETW!

My bank card was quite sore this morning as well.

You guys have some time. It is still an alpha, and I suspect the game will only improve in the coming months. My thoughts would be, if you don't like Steam, wait to see if another way to buy appears, and if it hasn't by the beginning of Beta, jump in on Steam.

Quote from: undercovergeek on May 03, 2012, 05:28:05 PM

i think i maybe first then - 23:26 thursday night here in Blighty and im waiting, although i read somewhere it will be 18:00 UK time tomorrow its released - just enough time to put undercover junior to bed, crack open the teapot and set sail on the high seas!

ill bash at it for 60 mins and come back here with some thoughts if thats ok

Sure!

My thought was I might be able to swing a review copy for you, that's all :)

I took the plunge last night. It's VERY polished for an alpha. Sort of puts Armada's UI to shame a bit.

Love the cards in battle idea.

Quote from: spelk on May 05, 2012, 12:38:26 PM

Love the cards in battle idea.

I was somewhat tempted untill i saw the cards in battle...  :o

Any updated feedback?  Getting close to making my normal impulse buy:)  I am not great at space games, especially when overly complex with a lot of management.  So if your able to respond, I would love to know how this game compares in those areas especially).  Lastly, does it seem like it will be plain fun or seem like work?

Thanks!

Quote from: Fetrik on May 05, 2012, 03:19:37 PM

Quote from: spelk on May 05, 2012, 12:38:26 PM

Love the cards in battle idea.

I was somewhat tempted untill i saw the cards in battle...  :o

I'll admit that aside from the Steam requirement, this is the one thing that's been putting me off as well. 

Not that a 4x title has to have a good battle system (or battles at all) to be fun -- Armada and GalCiv2 are both proof of that -- but if you're going to have a game that looks as nice as Endless Space, why not take advantage of it and allow full control of combat?  I don't care if it's turn-based, phased, or in real-time, but the whole "cards" system seems rather gimmicky to me. 

Of course, I obviously haven't played the game, so I can't criticize it too much, but I still have a feeling that ES's battle system may not appeal to me. 

It's funny but I rather like the idea of a very abstracted card based combat mode. The first battle or two I played reminded in some weird way of the DS game Infinite Space (http://www.sega.com/games/infinite-space/), where the battle plays out in stages, and you pick a decision in each phase. It might simplify the combat process somewhat, but if they can tie in the card effects to the ship building mechanic it might hit a sweet spot.

I enjoy RPG's that have tied in card battling mechanics, so that's probably the reason why I warm to this idea in ES.

Having put in a lot of hours over the last two days, there are two areas that still need a lot of work

Diplomacy doesn't appear to work at all. Right now I can't get any of the A.I. races to accept a cease fire, and dropping all kinds of free tech on them has no affect on their opinion of me. Plus, after attacking three of my outposts, I got a message that the Carvers don't trust me. WTF? Who attacked who here?

I'm still seeing ships attack and take damage at long and middle range even though they aren't equipped with beam or missile weapons. That has to be a bug.

I'm not pissed, since I realize the state of the game, but I am a bit disappointed that I've seen no response from the developers to any of the issues or questions being raised in the forums. Isn't that the point of letting an Alpha build out of it's cage early?

I like the combat system and the cards. I do not want to see an RTS click fest. That will grab an uninstall in a heartbeat. You are the Leader of your race, not captain Kirk. Let the ships fight.

As for ranges, I'm sure there will be more tweaking and also info as to what range has to do with combat. All of the weapons are capable of hitting at all ranges now. I have no problem with that as long the hit percentages and damage effects are adjusted for the range. Beams should have a high accuracy but lose punch over range. Guns should hit hard but lose accuracy over range. Missiles are slow, accurate, low ROF and high damage. I'd love to see more weapon types and hybrid effects of both weapons and defenses. They could use a boatload of equipment too. Combat computers, battle scanners, jammers, and fighters (needs to see some carrier action).

As for bugs, there are a few. Right side keyboard keys for alt, shift, ctrl do not work when trying to select techs or merge fleets.
Diplomacy is semi-functional, and you can raise game exceptions (but play through them).

All in all not a bad showing for an Alpha. I hope the Devs polish this up well. It has potential.

Quote from: tgb on May 06, 2012, 09:24:56 AM
Having put in a lot of hours over the last two days, there are two areas that still need a lot of work

Diplomacy doesn't appear to work at all. Right now I can't get any of the A.I. races to accept a cease fire, and dropping all kinds of free tech on them has no affect on their opinion of me. Plus, after attacking three of my outposts, I got a message that the Carvers don't trust me. WTF? Who attacked who here?

I'm still seeing ships attack and take damage at long and middle range even though they aren't equipped with beam or missile weapons. That has to be a bug.

I'm not pissed, since I realize the state of the game, but I am a bit disappointed that I've seen no response from the developers to any of the issues or questions being raised in the forums. Isn't that the point of letting an Alpha build out of it's cage early?

If you are trying to chat up the Carvers, you are barking up the wrong tree. That race is limited to always being in perpetual war and cannot sign Cease Fires or other treaties.

I had a race to a Cease Fire with me. A race's disposition will fall depending upon your actions. If you over expand (in their estimation) the disposition falls, if you have too few ships (and look weak) it will fall. I've had a race's disposition fall, only to rise again when I built more ships and looked more secure.

As to weapons firing, IIRC weapons fire at ALL stages of combat but their damage is optimized for specific ranges. So you still see damage done by kinetics at long range, but not nearly as much as at short range. That is where the combat cards come in - if you have a ship with only kinetic weapons, you can do minor damage in the first two rounds but you want to make sure you minimize the damage done by missiles (optimized at long range) and beams (optimized at medium range), then really pour out your modifiers at melee.  (OOPS... just realized Capn Darwin covered this a bit).

It may be a matter of interpretation but the faction description says the Carvers can't be at peace with everybody.  I take that to mean that they can be peace, but not with everybody at once.

As to combat - yeah, I finally got that, and it changes my whole approach to how I use the cards.  Which is why it's so frustrating that the developers aren't answering these questions.

Yeah, i noticed that over at the forums. You would think the devs would be involved in discussions but....nothing. gives me a little.concern

After kicking Craver butt in a hot war, they actually approached me and asked for a cease fire, which I accepted. I then found out that the situation only upgrades to a cold war, which means they can still attack my outposts (and vice versa).  And combat got a lot more interesting now that I actually understand it.

They're ignoring me too!  I tweeted at them to no avail. :(

Do you get more combat card options as your tech increases? Like differnt types of missles or something?

Quote from: mikeck on May 06, 2012, 07:57:14 PM
Do you get more combat card options as your tech increases? Like differnt types of missles or something?

You get both new cards and more powerful weapons.

You also get new cards when admirals level up, but those stay with the admiral.

I was reading over on the game's forums that even on the largest size, the map is limited to a rather paltry 123 star systems.  Can any of you guys confirm (or refute) this? 

Is there point to specialize ships? Say have your destroyers armed with beams and go charging in, while your dreadnaughts/battleships are armed with missiles and stay at range?

Along those same lines, can u have different ships in the same fleet do different things or does each card dictate the action of the whole fleet. If so, can u have more than one fleet fight at a time? Maybe a fleet of beam ships and a fleet of missle ships fighting at the same time?

^I don't have a definitive answer off-hand but I remember seeing paragraphs devoted to ships and their use and makeup in the PDF manual.

Cards dictate the action of the whole fleet, and ships in a fleet act as one.

Then is there any point to having different types of ships??/

Quote from: mikeck on May 08, 2012, 04:30:09 PM
Then is there any point to having different types of ships??/

What to you mean? Different sizes, or different builds of the same size? I could see you wanting to maximize damage at every range by having kinetic ships, missile ships, and beam ships. Or you may just want to build "jack of all trade" ships and only build one type. Different strategies, I suppose.

Quote from: son_of_montfort on May 08, 2012, 08:07:21 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 08, 2012, 04:30:09 PM
Then is there any point to having different types of ships??/

What to you mean? Different sizes, or different builds of the same size? I could see you wanting to maximize damage at every range by having kinetic ships, missile ships, and beam ships. Or you may just want to build "jack of all trade" ships and only build one type. Different strategies, I suppose.

No... whats the point of having Cruisers,Destroyers and Carriers if they all act the same way..?

Well, you can fit more stuff onto larger hulls.

Quote from: son_of_montfort on May 08, 2012, 11:30:27 PM
Well, you can fit more stuff onto larger hulls.

I think we're wondering more about the smaller ones, SoM. 

In other words:  Is there any point to building Destroyers if we can also build Cruisers?  Likewise, is there any point to building Cruisers if we can also build Dreadnoughts?  Etc. 

Joy!  We'll be able to dodge Steam when the game hits retail (http://www.indiegamemag.com/warp-speed-endless-space-hits-retail-on-august-24th/) on 24 August!

I hope they aren't being forced into a release date of the 24th, ready or not.

Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 09, 2012, 09:34:34 AM
Joy!  We'll be able to dodge Steam when the game hits retail (http://www.indiegamemag.com/warp-speed-endless-space-hits-retail-on-august-24th/) on 24 August!

Sweet. 

Legends of Pegasus is coming out first. Weird.

Quote from: Gusington on May 09, 2012, 12:51:36 PM
Legends of Pegasus is coming out first. Weird.

Provided it doesn't get pushed back again, of course...  :P 

Actually, given that Legends of Pegasus was announced long before Endless Space was, what's surprising is that the latter's release date is coming only a month after the former's.  It would indicate that development on ES is progressing much more quickly (too quickly?), and/or that development on LoP wasn't nearly as far along (relatively speaking) when it was first announced. 

^Yes. What?

Huh? 

Your above statement on the timetables of the two games has left me flummoxed. But I get the gist of what you're saying. Either way I will be buying them both. Actually I already bought Endless Space.

Just a heads up...Looks like there may be an Alpha 2 release on Steam today.  I can't find the original link where I saw the dev mention it, but here is a link to the A2 release notes (the A2 notes are the 2nd item in the link)...

http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?446-Playable-Alpha-Release-Notes

Wish I had some time to be playing ES, but all my free time lately has been spent on Warlock

^Me too. I am ready to declare a new Gaming Golden Age.

Certainly this is turning out to be the best year for tbs in a long time.  And we still have X-Com, Twilight Struggle, and Master of the Broken World to come.

^YES! And Legends of Pegasus.

^ And StarDrive! 

anyone had a go on the new alpha - i was prety much sold after the 28min vid on the 'other' site but im still just hanging on to the fence

oooo, twilight struggle, forgot that

Not tried it yet, but just a heads up to all that it was a full download of ES, not just a patch to A2...

I tried it but haven't played very long.  The two changes I noticed is you start with 5 tactics cards instead of 3, and that the only colonizeable world is the one on which you start (unless I just had some very bad luck).

wow this disappeared down the threads quickly - i crumbled and purchased in the steam spec. offer - only £17, barring gal civ 2 which i never did justice to it will be my first proper 4x space game - summer full release - looking forward to this very much

Quote from: undercovergeek on May 23, 2012, 06:19:35 AM
wow this disappeared down the threads quickly - i crumbled and purchased in the steam spec. offer - only £17, barring gal civ 2 which i never did justice to it will be my first proper 4x space game - summer full release - looking forward to this very much

Too many games, not enough time!  Seems like a lot of games have been released lately and there have also been some good sales/deals.  Just recently I've picked up Endless Space, Warlock, Crusader Kings 2, Naval War Arctic Circle, Steam and Iron, Port Royale 3, and SH5.  Hopefully with the long weekend coming up I'll have some time to get into ES.  Now excuse me, I have to go to my Wargamer Anonymous meeting  :o

Quote from: steve58 on May 23, 2012, 08:08:04 AM

Quote from: undercovergeek on May 23, 2012, 06:19:35 AM
wow this disappeared down the threads quickly - i crumbled and purchased in the steam spec. offer - only £17, barring gal civ 2 which i never did justice to it will be my first proper 4x space game - summer full release - looking forward to this very much

Too many games, not enough time!  Seems like a lot of games have been released lately and there have also been some good sales/deals.  Just recently I've picked up Endless Space, Warlock, Crusader Kings 2, Naval War Arctic Circle, Steam and Iron, Port Royale 3, and SH5.  Hopefully with the long weekend coming up I'll have some time to get into ES.  Now excuse me, I have to go to my Wargamer Anonymous meeting  :o

lol - did you get in on the 500 CK2s deal?

Quote from: steve58 on May 23, 2012, 08:08:04 AM

Too many games, not enough time!  Seems like a lot of games have been released lately and there have also been some good sales/deals.  Just recently I've picked up Endless Space, Warlock, Crusader Kings 2, Naval War Arctic Circle, Steam and Iron, Port Royale 3, and SH5.  Hopefully with the long weekend coming up I'll have some time to get into ES.  Now excuse me, I have to go to my Wargamer Anonymous meeting  :o

Are you the one who finished off the coffee and took the last donut? Damn, I know better than to be late to a meeting!

@ Undercovergeek -- I did snag a copy of CK2 for $10...too hard to resist

@ Steelgrave -- guilty as charged sir.  Krispy Kreme donuts are just too @$#! good.

Quote from: undercovergeek on May 23, 2012, 06:19:35 AM
wow this disappeared down the threads quickly - i crumbled and purchased in the steam spec. offer - only £17, barring gal civ 2 which i never did justice to it will be my first proper 4x space game - summer full release - looking forward to this very much

This game is pretty much at the top of my list, but as Steve, I have too many games and too little time.  This is an amazing time to be a strategy gamer!  Can't remember the last time I said that!

Yeah, and on a similar note, its a great time to be into Space 4x games with distant worlds, Armada, endless Space, Gemini wars and Legends of Pegasus. Plus, DONT LOOK NOW, but Sword of the Stars 2 has been patched up quite nicely and has brilliant tactical space combat.

^ also Distant Worlds!

Endless Space beta release is 6/4.

The beta will include the following new features (on top of many bugs and other changes since the first alpha):

• 8 playable factions: previous 5 plus the Amoeba, Sowers and the Pilgrims (art work above)
• Multiplayer enabled! You'll be able to play against 7 other players online
• German and French languages

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/06/endless-space-goes-beta-next-monday-4th-june/

Quote from: mikeck on May 23, 2012, 01:00:09 PM
Yeah, and on a similar note, its a great time to be into Space 4x games with distant worlds, Armada, endless Space, Gemini wars and Legends of Pegasus. Plus, DONT LOOK NOW, but Sword of the Stars 2 has been patched up quite nicely and has brilliant tactical space combat.

Quote from: son_of_montfort on May 23, 2012, 01:05:09 PM
^ also Distant Worlds!

Uh?  Was it the lack of caps that confused you?   ;)

Quote from: mikeck on May 23, 2012, 01:00:09 PM
Plus, DONT LOOK NOW, but Sword of the Stars 2 has been patched up quite nicely and has brilliant tactical space combat.

Is it actually playable now?

Quote from: Kushan on June 01, 2012, 02:53:56 PM

Quote from: mikeck on May 23, 2012, 01:00:09 PM
Plus, DONT LOOK NOW, but Sword of the Stars 2 has been patched up quite nicely and has brilliant tactical space combat.

Is it actually playable now?

It has been playable for quite some time now.  Kerberos still releases large patches every two weeks followed by a number of smaller ones in the day or two thereafter.

^ I keep meaning to try it again. That's good to know!

Guys, I'm telling you Sword of the Stars 2" is good to go. There are still a few bugs but it is where most games are at release and better than most paradox games at release! As far as space 4xs go, it is not as complex as, say, Distant Worlds, bit there is a lot to it. The tactical combat is better than any other 4x hands down. There is tons to research and I think the Ship design system is great. there are just so many types of ships and configurations available. Design what you want. Missles ships, pd ships, torpedo cruisers, beam ships, assault cruisers, mix of all, etc,. Betterr than any 4x as well. The strategy level is basically a shell to support the tactical battles similar to total war games. Graphics are good and its a lot of fun watching your ship designs gloriously fail as you attack an enemy fleet carrying tons of missles and you have no point defenses.

It's not the greatest space game ever, but if u liked SotS prime, u will like this. I think it is on sale on one of those sights...for $7.99 or something. My 2 cents.

EDIT: of course, right after I post this, they send out a huge patch that created a bug I'm tbe economy.  Mecron stated that there will be a hotfix sent out Saturday AM

I noticed a lot of UI lag when I booted it up last night. Any way to lessen that?

Endless Space is still the better game.

SoM, make sure u got the latest hotfix released early this am.

Tgb, to each their own. I find ES to be more polished and streamlined but far more simplified. I think which game is better depends on wjat you want. I will take some bugs if it means I get complex and deep tactical space combat and ship.design.

So, today I believe is the last day for the "alpha" discount price (according to a post on their official forums) on Steam because tomorrow they release the beta.  With that said, I have been watching this one from the sidelines.  I'll have to admit, I love the idea of space games like this, but every time I purchase one, I become overwhelmed and really never play them long.  I have tried galcivII, SOTS, distant worlds, armada, etc.

Is this game different enough that you think I might enjoy?  Is it simple enough for someone not really good with these games?  Or since I didn't enjoy the other space games, I am very unlikely to enjoy this one too?

I really "want" to like one of these games since I love the concept so I am interested in what people say....

Quote from: Grim.Reaper on June 03, 2012, 09:28:47 AM
So, today I believe is the last day for the "alpha" discount price (according to a post on their official forums) on Steam because tomorrow they release the beta.  With that said, I have been watching this one from the sidelines.  I'll have to admit, I love the idea of space games like this, but every time I purchase one, I become overwhelmed and really never play them long.  I have tried galcivII, SOTS, distant worlds, armada, etc.

Is this game different enough that you think I might enjoy?  Is it simple enough for someone not really good with these games?  Or since I didn't enjoy the other space games, I am very unlikely to enjoy this one too?

I really "want" to like one of these games since I love the concept so I am interested in what people say....

same camp as you grim, i see the epicness open up beforeme and come to a complete halt of oooo what do i do now? i always like a little 'get started this way' guide or a lets play vid to watch to get you kickstarted - but of all the ones i have barely started this one seems to be the best IMHO

Quote from: undercovergeek on June 03, 2012, 11:24:27 AM

Quote from: Grim.Reaper on June 03, 2012, 09:28:47 AM
So, today I believe is the last day for the "alpha" discount price (according to a post on their official forums) on Steam because tomorrow they release the beta.  With that said, I have been watching this one from the sidelines.  I'll have to admit, I love the idea of space games like this, but every time I purchase one, I become overwhelmed and really never play them long.  I have tried galcivII, SOTS, distant worlds, armada, etc.

Is this game different enough that you think I might enjoy?  Is it simple enough for someone not really good with these games?  Or since I didn't enjoy the other space games, I am very unlikely to enjoy this one too?

I really "want" to like one of these games since I love the concept so I am interested in what people say....

same camp as you grim, i see the epicness open up beforeme and come to a complete halt of oooo what do i do now? i always like a little 'get started this way' guide or a lets play vid to watch to get you kickstarted - but of all the ones i have barely started this one seems to be the best IMHO

UC, are you saying you do own ES?  And if so, from what you see it appears the best for people like us?

yup, i got in at alpha after all the hullaballoo here.

Its just so easy to play, everything has a mouse over context to let you know what its there for and what its supposed to do and why. I find with all these games theres a tipping point, a point at which you think right ive won this, but ive still got 6 hours to go to mop up - whereas this one challenges everystep of the way, have you won it or not? are you in the lead? and i like very much the combat system with the card useage - it has put some off i know but i like it this way

Quote from: undercovergeek on June 03, 2012, 02:16:50 PM
yup, i got in at alpha after all the hullaballoo here.

Its just so easy to play, everything has a mouse over context to let you know what its there for and what its supposed to do and why. I find with all these games theres a tipping point, a point at which you think right ive won this, but ive still got 6 hours to go to mop up - whereas this one challenges everystep of the way, have you won it or not? are you in the lead? and i like very much the combat system with the card useage - it has put some off i know but i like it this way

Well, I pulled the trigger...keeping fingers crossed:)

Quote from: undercovergeek on June 03, 2012, 02:16:50 PM
yup, i got in at alpha after all the hullaballoo here.

Its just so easy to play, everything has a mouse over context to let you know what its there for and what its supposed to do and why. I find with all these games theres a tipping point, a point at which you think right ive won this, but ive still got 6 hours to go to mop up - whereas this one challenges everystep of the way, have you won it or not? are you in the lead? and i like very much the combat system with the card useage - it has put some off i know but i like it this way

ES has a very slick UI and is very easy to get into. What's nice to see is these Indy developers trying new stuff instead of merely copying something older. Like it or not, the card system is unique and it seems thay the game is almost bug free at beta for Pete's sake

I noticed an update from Steam, so I launched the game.  Sure enough, the beta is out and I'm looking forward to diving in later. One thing I notice about the Pilgrims - they have the ability to abandon their home system and set up elsewhere.

I'm not sure how I feel about Endless Space.  Sure it has a pretty easy to use UI.  Some depth to research and colony development.  Ship design is ok, I guess.  Battles are meh imo.  I like the concept card driven battles, but frankly its not very exciting at all.

I'm going to play some more to see if mid-late game changes my mind currently at around turn 90 in my game.

Yeah, lots of new 4x but unfortunately, none seem to fully scratch the itch. The best I think is Distant Worlds. Would like to play that but replace it with the Sword of the Stars combat system and the planet/system development of Endless Space. Argghh

I really enjoy Distant Worlds.

Quote from: Bison on June 12, 2012, 03:56:44 PM
I really enjoy Distant Worlds.

Me too....until combat comes around....*pew* *pew* *pew*!

Quote from: Bison on June 12, 2012, 03:40:59 PM
I'm not sure how I feel about Endless Space.  Sure it has a pretty easy to use UI.  Some depth to research and colony development.  Ship design is ok, I guess.  Battles are meh imo.  I like the concept card driven battles, but frankly its not very exciting at all.

I'm going to play some more to see if mid-late game changes my mind currently at around turn 90 in my game.

The combat system is receiving a fair bit of criticism in the official forums as well.  The words "boring" and "bland" are appearing frequently in conjunction with the topic, which worries me. 

Of course, battles in Armada 2526 suck too, and I still love that game... 

Quote from: Bison on June 12, 2012, 03:56:44 PM
I really enjoy Distant Worlds.

Ditto that.  It isn't perfect, but it's still easily one of the most fun 4x games I've ever played.  Definitely in my top 5 list. 




@mikeck:  It's still better than a lot of 4x titles I've seen! 

I'm starting to feel that calling them boring or bland is being nice.  Its all a bit silly.  3 phases of like 20 seconds each.  Why?  Its turn based, right?  Sort of unless you don't play a card then the AI just plays one for you.  The animations are the same just a different number of ships based on fleet numbers, but who cares they are essentially a cut screen.  You cannot pan around to see the battle as the computer plays it out.  So battles all come down to playing 3 cards.  Sort of.  Its still he with the greatest number of ships most often wins even though there can be some variation with weapon/shield choices.  The battle mechanics just don't work for me.  I want them too, because the rest of the game has some potential. 

Yep, that is my complaint about ES. For me, Im less about the first 3 "X's" of a 4X and more about "eXtermination". So for me, the first 3 are merely a shell to get ready for Space battles. When those battles are as anti-climactic as ES's....it kills it for me. I enjoy DW in spite of the combat simply because the rest is so deep, it mitigates the (2d sprite??sheesh) battles.

I really want to like ES but with movie cut screen battles and Magic the gathering card drops, , its just...boring to me. Slick UI and very polished, but boring.

With Gemini sucking....all hope for me is with Pegasus right now. Luckily, between, SoaSE, SoTS 2, DW, ES, and Armada...there is really something for everyone.

I can see myself playing either Endless Space or Legends of Pegasus depending on my mood.

I'm leaning more toward LoP or StarDrive myself.  However, I suspect I'll end up getting ES eventually. 

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 08:45:49 AM
Luckily, between, SoaSE, SoTS 2, DW, ES, and Armada...there is really something for everyone.

Very true (happily). 

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 08:45:49 AM
Yep, that is my complaint about ES. For me, Im less about the first 3 "X's" of a 4X and more about "eXtermination". So for me, the first 3 are merely a shell to get ready for Space battles. When those battles are as anti-climactic as ES's....it kills it for me. I enjoy DW in spite of the combat simply because the rest is so deep, it mitigates the (2d sprite??sheesh) battles.

I really want to like ES but with movie cut screen battles and Magic the gathering card drops, , its just...boring to me. Slick UI and very polished, but boring.

With Gemini sucking....all hope for me is with Pegasus right now. Luckily, between, SoaSE, SoTS 2, DW, ES, and Armada...there is really something for everyone.

There are no "Card Drops", you get cards by researching them.
And frankly I quite like the combat. It reminds me of the one in Dominions series and the Lost Empire series a bit, just with a twist. :)

I like the social interactive aspect of PBEM or RT.... so make up your minds what we should all orgy over .... 4X gameplay wise

Quote from: Windigo on June 13, 2012, 12:24:36 PM
I like the social interactive aspect of PBEM or RT.... so make up your minds what we should all orgy over .... 4X gameplay wise

Meh, my social intereaction is limited to steel baton swinging so I'm more of a singel player guy. But I would say Endless Space and Armada  would be the most "orgy freindly" of all of the 4xs...

Legends of Pegasus does look pretty good.  You can see a lot of influence in it from several different games.

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 12:45:49 PM

Meh, my social intereaction is limited to steel baton swinging...

You are so my personal hero.

not so much a hero to grammarians, typists and spell checkers everywhere...as I re-read my post. Holy typos.

^Nah we still like you.

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 02:15:33 PM
not so much a hero to grammarians, typists and spell checkers everywhere...as I re-read my post. Holy typos.

If you could type grammatically correct English, you would probably not be employed as a steel baton swinger.  ;)

Or maybe that's the only job an English major can get these days?

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on June 13, 2012, 02:37:36 PM

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 02:15:33 PM
not so much a hero to grammarians, typists and spell checkers everywhere...as I re-read my post. Holy typos.

If you could type grammatically correct English, you would probably not be employed as a steel baton swinger.  ;)

Yeah, I suppose as long as I am able to yell "Quit resisting!", the rest of my English and grammar skills are surplusage.

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 03:03:05 PM

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on June 13, 2012, 02:37:36 PM

Quote from: mikeck on June 13, 2012, 02:15:33 PM
not so much a hero to grammarians, typists and spell checkers everywhere...as I re-read my post. Holy typos.

If you could type grammatically correct English, you would probably not be employed as a steel baton swinger.  ;)

Yeah, I suppose as long as I am able to yell "Quit resisting!", the rest of my English and grammar skills are surplusage.

Unfortunately this very important skill won't make the combat in ES anymore exciting.

^  So *is* the combat system the main sticking point in Endless Space?  Any other major/fundamental weaknesses, or would you say that is, in fact, the "big issue"? 

Its not for many, it is for others. I think everyone would agree that the UI is good, graphics are good for a 4x, planetary /sytem deveopment is good and relatively deep and the tech tree is good. That said, Diplomacy is lacking but is so in almost all 4x's.

Some people love the card based combat. To be clear, I'm not opposed to it so much as the way it is implemented. You have a very short time to pick the card and then you watch a "cut scene" of combat. You cant move the camera. Now, to be fair, others dont care.

You can get a good idea by watching the youtube videos...what you see is what you get.  I have seen very very few bugs.

Quote from: Martok on June 14, 2012, 10:21:47 AM
^  So *is* the combat system the main sticking point in Endless Space?  Any other major/fundamental weaknesses, or would you say that is, in fact, the "big issue"? 

For me yes.  I just don't find it to be something I enjoy.  There are some other aspects of the game I don't really overly enjoy, but they are all like the combat just a matter of taste.

I like the combat, and the only change I would make to the system is make it so you could only use a card once per battle.  Some cards are overpowered if played 2 or 3 times.

There you have it.  Some people like the combat and some don't.  It comes down to a matter of taste.

Wading into the Great Combat Debate...

I've been cooling on Endless Space recently because, like mikeck, I tend to veer toward eXterminate in these games and combat just sounds boring as hell.  But then I watched this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwLbal5cdbw) and concluded that combat looks pretty exciting after all!  I think I'm going to put Endless Space right at the top of The List now.

The "tactical" combat is just fine.  I think the Total War addicts just want something more than a short card game as battle filler.

I like the concept for the combat, and do wish it had a bit more to it (even if it were just an extra couple play rounds).  But at the same time, I'm extremely happy that it's not a sh*tty RTS tac battle mini-game, with unchallenging AI, which drives me to just hitting the Auto-Battle button after a couple battles.  This 3-round "tactic" play is a nice medium between those two where you still have input but aren't wasting 30 minutes on an ambitious, but ultimately lame, tac battle facet. 

Nice quick resolution, and you still get to make a few choices and see stuff blow up.    :)  The big focus on these 4X games has always been campaign planning, and the past RTS or WEGO tac battles in them sucked.


I think the current big issues are the AI - especially concerning Diplomacy and in some races' cases - galactic expansion.    And some of the non-military/expansion victory conditions' requirements being too high (Diplo victory is the biggie here).

My concerns with the combat are as follows: 


1.)  Do the battle cards offer meaningful choices?  Thus far, my general impression (from both here and the ES forums) is that the answer is "no".  Most of what I've read indicates the larger (and/or more advanced) fleet is going to win pretty much every time, regardless of which cards (tactics) are used.  So what's the point of even having/using them? 

2.)  Camera view:  I keep reading that the camera view is severely restricted, and that the player is unable to select a different one.  If you're going to show us pretty-looking battles, shouldn't we at least be able to watch them from the angle/perspective we want? 

3.)  Ship sizes:  Most of what I've read indicates that bigger is always better, and that smaller ships effectively become obsolete once a larger chassis becomes available. 

BTW, did you see the Legend of Pegasus screens up on Steam. The planet development screen looks EXACTLY like Ascendency! Awesome!

Quote from: son_of_montfort on June 23, 2012, 09:34:31 AM
BTW, did you see the Legend of Pegasus screens up on Steam. The planet development screen looks EXACTLY like Ascendency! Awesome!

Yeah, I've seen that screenshot before.  Look pretty damn cool. 

Quote from: Nefaro on June 23, 2012, 07:35:23 AMBut at the same time, I'm extremely happy that it's not a sh*tty RTS tac battle mini-game, with unchallenging AI, which drives me to just hitting the Auto-Battle button after a couple battles.  This 3-round "tactic" play is a nice medium between those two where you still have input but aren't wasting 30 minutes on an ambitious, but ultimately lame, tac battle facet. 

Nice quick resolution, and you still get to make a few choices and see stuff blow up.

Well said.  I've watched some more videos in the meantime and I'm getting really excited about the game (again) now.  All I have to do is find one of those "job" things and I can buy it!

Quote from: Huw the Poo on June 23, 2012, 11:48:12 AM

Quote from: Nefaro on June 23, 2012, 07:35:23 AMBut at the same time, I'm extremely happy that it's not a sh*tty RTS tac battle mini-game, with unchallenging AI, which drives me to just hitting the Auto-Battle button after a couple battles.  This 3-round "tactic" play is a nice medium between those two where you still have input but aren't wasting 30 minutes on an ambitious, but ultimately lame, tac battle facet. 

Nice quick resolution, and you still get to make a few choices and see stuff blow up.

Well said.  I've watched some more videos in the meantime and I'm getting really excited about the game (again) now.  All I have to do is find one of those "job" things and I can buy it!

Thanks Huw.

No worries.  It's still in beta, and although it's quite well-done it does still have some tweaking to be done.  So perhaps by the time you rob a bank, or snatch a purse, stuff will be perfect.   ;D

Also note that a vote was given, by the dev team, about choosing between a few improvement options.   Adding a free camera to the battles was the winner, although I would've liked to see something a bit more gameplay-related done, myself.

Heh, that reminds me of our recent conversation (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=1842.msg37987#msg37987) about player suggestions. :)

Quote from: Huw the Poo on June 24, 2012, 03:16:03 AM
Heh, that reminds me of our recent conversation (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=1842.msg37987#msg37987) about player suggestions. :)

LOL yeah.  Exactly!

Looks like a release date of July 4th. 

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/06/endless-space-releases-on-the-4th-of-july/

Wow, that was fast.  I was under the impression they were still about a month away. 

Quote from: Martok on June 27, 2012, 08:58:38 AM
Wow, that was fast.  I was under the impression they were still about a month away.

Same.

I kept hearing that they had some AI tweaking to do still.  :o

I can't handle this right now...too much in the gaming queue. How dare they.

Quote from: Gusington on June 27, 2012, 12:34:59 PM
I can't handle this right now...too much in the gaming queue. How dare they.

Good thing it's over a long holiday weekend.  Unfortunately, I'm going to be camping with a large group of friends, so just getting my turns in for the Armada game I'm in is going to be tight.  On the bright side, it'll give the devs time to work on a patch before I buy.

^I have to work next week!!

OK I am REALLY enjoying this game.  I've put about 31 turns in so far and I'm very, very impressed.  I don't know if the designers are inherently good at the job or whether it's a function of democracy-led design, but it's absolutely bursting with great ideas.  The UI is fantastic, easily one of the best I've ever seen.  All the information you need is just always right there, with no need to click around.  Get this:

You're looking at your (sortable, of course) colony list.  Along with all the food, research points etc that each colony is producing you can see stuff like which ship/improvement is being worked on.  Click this cell, and you get to see everything else in the queue without having to "go" to the colony in question!  It just appears at the bottom and you never have to leave the colony list.

It's such a little thing, but it really does make the game easier to play, and that's just one of a thousand little touches.  It's very, very well made.

As for the battles...I needn't have worried.  Admittedly I've only had little skirmishes yet, but from what I've seen they're hardly the rock paper scissors affairs that some have described (not here, but around the net).  The cards are only modifiers.  Some are significant, yes, but a lot depends on your ship design and fleet composition too.  +40% to a weapon that only does 5 damage in the first place is nothing.  And let's not forget that the more powerful cards have costs associated - and must be researched, too.  It's all fair in love and war.  The cinematics may get old at some point, sure, but they're still a lot more than you get with plenty of other 4X games.

Loving the game so far.  I hope it doesn't disappoint me in the long run, but I can't see it happening!

Oh man...... Now I'm gonna have to get this too......  :P

8)

Barthheart, the best thing you can do is watch some videos, like the combat one I posted a few posts ago - that's what finally tipped me over the edge and I had to buy it.  30 minutes or so of "let's play" will probably show you what you need.  But so far I can say that it's easily one of the best 4X games I've played.

I think I read there's a faction designer coming soon. \o/

Faction designer? Sweet.

It feels like a next-gen game.  Remember how we were all wowed by the strategic zoom of Supreme Commander?  Well, Endless Space has more than one of those moments.  Every single part of the interface has been designed to allow you to get the most info, and perform the most actions, by using the fewest clicks.  Tooltips abound, and there are little icons and colour coding used everywhere to save you reading reams of text when you're in a hurry to do something.

Another good example.  When a fleet is in a system, you can designate it as a defender, meaning it will intercept any ships entering the system.  Well, the colony list shows you at a glance (by means of a little coloured dot) which systems are defended in this manner.

Looking at the fleet list, one of the columns will of course tell you where each fleet is located.  But the little icon accompanying the system name shows you whether it's your system or not, and whether it's colonised.

As I said earlier, there's a thousand little details like this all throughout the game.  It's just the best interface I've seen.

Stop! Stop! I'm weak enough as it is......   :P

Sigh......


Alright, tomorrow while my wife is working and I'm home I'll take another look.


Just what I need... another 4X space game.... Gotta retire soon so I can at least try to play everything.  :P

I've only scratched the surface with my gushing, too. ;)

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 01, 2012, 02:07:20 PM
I've only scratched the surface with my gushing, too. ;)

....groan....

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 01, 2012, 12:17:57 PM


As I said earlier, there's a thousand little details like this all throughout the game.  It's just the best interface I've seen.

That was my biggest praise - the excellent interface. 

Right then, now that I've put a decent amount of time in...questions!

What determines which battles I get to control myself?  I just had two battles at the same system, both instigated by the enemy.  The first one popped up and I took manual control, and kicked his arse.  That was the smaller battle.  When I was dumped back at the galaxy screen I saw that the much larger engagement - the one I really wanted to participate in myself - had already played out and I lost. :(

Approval.  I need to wrap my head around this one.  Why, for example, are my systems unhappy with "overpopulation" when each system has free population slots on each of their worlds?  That isn't overpopulation!  Also, why does a system get an approval penalty because of "planets"?  What does that mean?  As far as I can tell, planets don't seem to have individual approval ratings so what's going on here?

Let me ask this about the interface.  A lot of games seem to have good interfaces at the beginning and middle part of the game, but don't seem to hold up very well late game, especially in very large maps.  Will Endless Spaces interface hold up well to late game large map games.

Huw, from what I understand, there is nothing you can do about the multiple battle issue. It has been brought up repeatedly in the forums. OJ, yes, the UI is superb and holds up. Some, like me, dislike the combat in the game, but, if you don't mind it, the UI alone makes it worth a look.

From what I hear, the release version may include a moveable camera for battles which will make them more immersive

Too...many...games...

Quote from: mikeck on July 01, 2012, 06:09:54 PM
Huw, from what I understand, there is nothing you can do about the multiple battle issue. It has been brought up repeatedly in the forums.

Wow, really?  That's extremely disappointing.

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 01, 2012, 04:50:57 PM
Also, why does a system get an approval penalty because of "planets"?  What does that mean?  As far as I can tell, planets don't seem to have individual approval ratings so what's going on here?

They do. Mousing over the type of planet or special features most of them affect happiness in one way or another.

Quote from: tgb on July 02, 2012, 06:21:47 AM
They do. Mousing over the type of planet or special features most of them affect happiness in one way or another.

Oh man, did I really miss that?  Thanks mate.  Any idea about overpopulation?

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 02, 2012, 11:54:57 AM
  Any idea about overpopulation?

It's just an empire-wide penalty for quick expansions (before getting down the proper tech lines to mitigate it).   It's an artificial 'soft' deterrant against running a colonization steamroller across systems. 

You can reduce some of the population unhappiness penalties via some of the techs on the leftmost tech tree.  So if you're doing that tech tree, you could technically have more empire population without suffering all the extra unhappiness penalties to production & such.  Also.. I think you can have some random system rebellions, and/or foreign empires instigating them, if individual systems get too unhappy.  I've not play far enough in to see that happen yet, as I've paused while waiting on this "big" release update that is to come.

Ah, splendid.  Thanks Nefaro.

Hmm.  For a turn-based strategy game, there's a lot of real-time strategy...

Alright  Huw, I bought the damn game today and 4 hours just evaporated!!  :P

Really cool looking and playing game. Kinda reminds me of SOTS I, only better.

Turn 104 and I'm starting to get the hang of combat. Playing on a 4 arm spiral galaxy and I'm trapped out at the end of one arm with and AI race blocking my way in. Gonna have to blast my way through.

So much for what little spare time I had...... :-\

Haha, I'm glad you're enjoying it since I feel partially responsible for you buying it!  Amazing interface isn't it?

I can't decide whether to continue the game I'm playing, start a new one now that I know how to play, or wait until the next update.

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 03, 2012, 05:41:08 PM
Haha, I'm glad you're enjoying it since I feel partially responsible for you buying it!  Amazing interface isn't it?

I can't decide whether to continue the game I'm playing, start a new one now that I know how to play, or wait until the next update.

So since the official release is tomorrow, is there expected to be some kind of update with the "final" release version code?  If so, is there any hints anywhere what will be included or just final tweaking?

AFAIK there hasn't been much in the way of updates this past month. 

Rumor was that they had been hard at work on the AI and other tweaks, so I've been expecting an update soon.  Day 0 patch or something..

Slowly getting the hang of the game but have some questions:

What determines when a colony's influence area expands?

I've started 4 games so far and I always end up with at least 1, and sometimes 2, other empires right next to me? Their random setup doesn't seem to spread people out enough on the huge galaxy settings....

Question for anyone who's been playing:  How is the AI?  Any good, or is it a pushover right now? 

Quote from: Barthheart on July 04, 2012, 08:50:39 AM

I've started 4 games so far and I always end up with at least 1, and sometimes 2, other empires right next to me? Their random setup doesn't seem to spread people out enough on the huge galaxy settings....

Hmm, that does sound troubling.  Even with all 8 races enabled, I'd expect everyone to be a little more spread out. 

So far the AI is pretty good. Not a push over. It builds good strong fleets and seems to expand well. The "evil" guys play evil and the "nice" guys will play nice if you do.

So far so good.

Quote from: Martok on July 04, 2012, 09:46:33 AM
Question for anyone who's been playing:  How is the AI?  Any good, or is it a pushover right now? 

I haven't completed a game yet so I'm witholding judgement, however I can say that it does at least adapt.  I was slugging it out against one race and both of us were using kinetic weapons, so the victor was usually he who brought the most ships.  However I eventually started using beam weapons which severely kicked his arse.  A few turns later, he shows up with beams incorporated into his own designs.

Not so much great AI, but at the very least it's an area where the AI could easily have sucked and didn't. :)

QuoteHmm, that does sound troubling.  Even with all 8 races enabled, I'd expect everyone to be a little more spread out. 

I haven't experimented with map sizes yet but I'm sure I've read somewhere that the maximum number of systems is disappointingly small.

Quote from: Huw the Poo on July 04, 2012, 12:34:56 PM


I haven't experimented with map sizes yet but I'm sure I've read somewhere that the maximum number of systems is disappointingly small.

Yeah, that's probably why you start fairly close to other races so much.   You're not going to have hundreds of systems like a game of Distant Worlds.  But then again, you get to do more micromanagement of every planet within each system so I'm okay with the trade-off so far. 

It does seem like you always start a couple-three systems away from someone no matter how many AI players in the game .. in the spiral galaxy type anyway.  I suspect the spiral arm placement tends to do that.  I've not tried one of the other types yet.

So does the release version have a moveable battle camera?
Edit: I see it does below!

Big update today = confirmed.

Downloading now.  8)

Quote
1.0.3
CHANGES AND ADDITIONS
- Changed the save file system. The previous files are not compatible.
- Added the custom faction screen.
- Added a free camera mode in the battle view.
+ Arrow keys: move the view
+ Mouse wheel: changes the camera field of view (angle)
+ Mouse right click + pan: rotates the camera view
+ Ctrl: sticks / unsticks the camera on your fleet
- You can continue to play after a victory condition is achieved.
- Added a state to the player, to know if he's in a battle or not.
- Added an animatic for each faction, which will be displayed for a new game.
- Added narrative & random events illustrations.
- Changed the illustration for the selection of "Random Faction".
- Changed the Pirates 3D fleet icon.
- Added several outgame scenes, which will be displayed randomly.
- All technologies have a dedicated icon.
- Added 5 new music.
- Added new GUI sounds.
- Added an ES soundtrack directory (in the Steam install directory of Endless Space on your computer).
- Added the ES credits.
- Texture, video, memory & AI optimization.
- Added one new difficulty mode - Endless.
- Food consumption by population will vary with game speed.
- Heroes will not be injured when retreating. Changed the 'Death before dishonor' faction trait.
- Ship levels increase HP, DamageMin, DamageMax, InterceptionAccuracy, DeflectionPerTurn and Absorption.
- Changed the ship leveling, which now requires more XP (6 to 45 -> 4 to 100)
- Decreased the defense mods' cost (3 to 75 -> 2 to 58).
- Decreased the defense mods' weight (7 to 20 -> 5 to 16).
- Antimissile and Shield mods are now more powerful than their Weapon counterpart.
- Deflectors bonuses were only slightly increased.
- Halved Defense MP (8 to 210 -> 4 to 125) but not their efficiency in general.
- Defense MP is less effective during invasions than weapons.
- Added an extra bonus on the armor mods (25 to 304 -> 25 to 220+12%).
- Modified the Bluecap mold monopoly bonus (Dust -> Approval).
- Reduced the difficulty of diplomatic victory ( 1000 + 10*(players)*(planets) -> 2000 + 15*(players)*(planets) ).
- Decreases the malus of the random event "SUPERNOVA DISRUPTS NAVIGATION MAPS" (-80% -> -30%)
- When playing sower, the player knows the actual FIDS of a planet before colonizing it.
- Decreased the Alliance bonus multiplier (Alliance : * 2 -> Alliance : * 1,6).

FIXES
IMPORTANT FIXES
- Fixed an issue where the leech hero ability will not stop upon conquering the star system.
- Fixed an issue where an assert is received when a system is conquered by the AI and the user is in System view on the same system.
- [MP] Fixed an issue where assert is received when joining an in-progress session.
- [MP] Fixed an issue where opening the war notification as host will cause an assert.
- Fixed an issue where pressing ESC after quitting a game will cause an assert.
- Fixed an issue where the game crashes 100% after loading a specific save game.
- Fixed an issue where loading a saved game from another Steam account causes an assert.

OTHER FIXES
- Fixed several text issues.
- Fixed several localized text issues.
- Fixed an issue where the browsing arrows become unresponsive in planet view in a 2 planet system.
- Fixed an issue where the moon orbiting a planet will not adjust size properly in planet view.
- Fixed an issue where the heal button is not functional on the Assign to system screen.
- Fixed an issue where a graphical corruption can be seen when entering the star system.
- Fixed an issue where the Permanent Perennials star system improvement is not working.
- Fixed an issue where the resolution will not change to 1600x900 when in windowed mode.
- Fixed an issue where the user will have the buyout option active for a ship that cannot be completed normally (strategic prerequisite or obsolete ship design).
- Fixed an issue where the amount of military power is displayed using decimals on the battle report.
- [MP] Fixed an issue where ships are displayed as being in hangar on other player`s system.
- Fixed an issue where the name of the empire is not replaced in the current deals with button.
- Fixed an issue where cease fire are not spread to allies.
- Fixed an issue where the initial starting population decreases right after the first turn at slow game speed.
- Fixed an issue where disband/create fleet does not refresh movement points.
- Fixed an issue where the race names are seen in the language of the other player.
- Fixed an issue where the Hissho Affinity tool tip is not updated.
- Fixed an issue where the United Empire Affinity tool tip is not updated.
- Fixed an issue where the "Industry to Science" conversion tool tip is not updated.
- Fixed an issue where the user is able to select guard action on an enemy`s fleet.
- Fixed an issue where technologies do not affect the deal approval.
- Fixed an issue where actual faction names were not updated in the Diplomatic Negotiations Screen when choosing random factions.

Quote from: mikeck on July 04, 2012, 02:54:08 PM
So does the release version have a moveable battle camera?

It does now.

My earlier dilemma about whether to restart was solved by the latest update which renders save games incompatible...which Steam promptly downloaded without asking first.  Another reason to dislike that bloody service.

(Yeah I know, you can turn it off - but it's per-game, and I like to rant about Steam  :P)

Thanks to the tips in this thread, my new game has been much better.  I'm being much more selective about which worlds I colonise, at least for the time being.  It still doesn't take long before I needed to start building Infinite Supermarkets all over the place, though.

Edit: I want to play 2v2 with locked teams, dammit!

This just screams for an MP game.... Anyone know how that works?

Quote from: Barthheart on July 04, 2012, 05:04:29 PM
This just screams for an MP game.... Anyone know how that works?

While it's turn-based, it seems that lots of things run like a WEGO system.  I suppose that multiplayer is pretty much a full WEGO setup?

I started a new game as the Pilgrims, and I'm having a ball. I'm playing a medium 4-arm spiral galaxy with pirates turned off, and I had my initial cluster to myself, which gave me an opportunity for rapid expansion.  Now that I'm able to travel through wormholes, I've met the Amoeba and the United Empire.  It's too early to comment on the A.I., since the map is made up of small clusters of stars connected by wormholes with a lot of choke points. I did destroy an Amoeba exploration ship just to see the new camera controls, but it doesn't seem to have had any effect on diplomacy, which is a little worrisome. Still, I'm happy,but I was also happy with the state of the beta, so YMMV.

One thing - the battle camera seems to be off by default.  You have to click on the little box in the lower rt. hand corner to enable it.

Patch notes say the AI had some extra work done (amongst a lot of other things). 

Anyone know if the Pirates got nerfed lately?

Just fired up my copy to take a look around and it still indicates that it's a beta. Anyone know what is going on with that?

Try closing down Steam and then re-starting.  It should then update (hopefully)...

^Did that. Then before I started it again,  the game downloaded something that I thought was the file that would bring it up to release status...?

If I remember right, when ES was released on 7/4, the whole game got re-downloaded from Steam. 

If your game isn't showing ver 1.0.5, then you could try verifying the game cache (in your Steam library, right click on ES, select Properties, click on Local Files, select verify integrity of game cache).  If that doesn't clear it up, it might be best to delete ES, and then reload it...

^Weird. Steam has been wonky anyway. Redownloading now. Thanks again!

So... I just finished my first game. I won a Wonder Victory playing as the Pilgrams.

Was very pissed when I saw this screen:  >:(

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg204.imageshack.us%2Fimg204%2F2953%2F2012070800001.jpg&hash=d20fb7f6bd501bff5a2dde75f0c55d2dd4882fa9)

That's all you get for winning!!!! Then I hit quit game and got this:

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg163.imageshack.us%2Fimg163%2F4907%2F2012070800002.jpg&hash=090f9b01cae2075f8fd0a3748f2428dfa7879851)

This screen has various tabs so you can compare your empire to the others in various areas of interest: score, production, people, systems etc. Good but mo movie or anything.

Steam says I played for 23 hours. But that included a couple of false starts, so maybe 20 hours to win. Not too bad.
I was playing normal everything, except extra systems, on a 2 arm spiral. This will definately start you close to others. I found these pics in the files that shows how the galaxies are setup:

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg507.imageshack.us%2Fimg507%2F8104%2Fcapturebp.jpg&hash=6cffaec6d15062f3ef681f3b97d83f2d0094a2a6)

Also reading the manual it's possible to setup a game where it's very hard to interact with a neighbor until you discover free space travel methods.

Fun game. Will have to try a harder setup next.  8)

PS. Just noticed that my empire colour was blue, and notice where the blue section is in teh pic of the 2 arm galaxy...! That's where I started. I wonder if start location is locked for each colour on each map type....

i know you say 20 hours - but how far into that 20 did you realise you were going to win - were you pushed for the victory?

Well... since it was my first game I really didn't know what kinds of victory were possible.

When I was reaching the end of one branch of the tech tree I saw the tech that let me build what was necessary to win. I'd sy that was bout 3 hours before I won. I then pushed hard for that type of win.

I'd had just finished a major boarder war with the next most powerful empire so, I wasn't fighting. It did seem a bit odd that all the AI's didn't jump me near the end as I approached victory. They seemed to be wrapped up in their own wars and machinations... although my neighbor was getting an increasingly hostile attitude towards me. I just won before he could mount an assault.

I was in second last place for about 1/2 of the game until a different neighbor attacked me and I decided to take him out completely. That got me a lot of terriory and left me with a large space force. I was in 2nd place then. I then pushed hard in teching up and that started the second border war.

So after all that rambling, no I don't think I was pushed to get teh victory but it didn't seem like a slow slog either 'cause it happend in the last 2 hours and there was lots to do still.

I will say however that I think there needs to be some work done on the planet develpoment side of things. I literally just built every possible improvement in every system. It didn't feel like there was much of a reason to pick and chose....

Yeah, you're often safe with building all the planetary improvements.  The problem there is that some of those planets won't be running efficiently and some improvements may be working against each other or the planet's situational strength.

I build to a planet's strengths and don't bother with the time & money to make improvements that lessen it.  Most planet types have more potential in certain production types and numerous improvements have penalties in addition to bonuses that are pretty specific. 

I found that the biggest curb to my expansion & size was population happiness (and thus a retardation of production & possible revolts) which required some social research (and that researches' improvements) to mitigate.  That was also something I had to prioritize, and ultimately the time it takes to build stuff was also a big part of the decision making on this part.

At the start of the game, until you have the research and the luxuries to help it, keeping the tax rate at about 10% will keep most of your systems ecstatic, and the faster population growth combined with expansion at a reasonable rate should keep you in the black financially.

Quote from: tgb on July 08, 2012, 06:36:28 PM
At the start of the game, until you have the research and the luxuries to help it, keeping the tax rate at about 10% will keep most of your systems ecstatic, and the faster population growth combined with expansion at a reasonable rate should keep you in the black financially.

Yeah, using the tax rate slider helps you mitigate that for a good while. 

I know that they reduced the happiness bonuses for low taxes not too long ago, but I still think that tax slider's bonuses are negating the expansion penalties a bit too much.  It's still pretty powerful for the relatively small amounts of taxes lost.

Quote from: Barthheart on July 08, 2012, 07:37:49 AM
So... I just finished my first game. I won a Wonder Victory playing as the Pilgrams.

Was very pissed when I saw this screen:  >:(

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg204.imageshack.us%2Fimg204%2F2953%2F2012070800001.jpg&hash=d20fb7f6bd501bff5a2dde75f0c55d2dd4882fa9)

That's all you get for winning!!!! Then I hit quit game and got this ...

I just recently completed a game too and was a bit annoyed about the victory screen.  But what was more annoying to me is that apparently there was a 300 turn timelimit I was not aware of.  I was literally 2 turns away from a diplomatic victory and even if somehow that hadn't worked, I was about 10 turns away from an Endless Empire victory. 

Hmmm. Have been tempted to take the plunge on this but I'm not hearing people just raving about how great it is.

Too be honest, I really am enjoying the game otherwise.   It's not perfect, namely a somewhat uneven AI but it's still pretty fun and it captures my imagination at least.  I do think the victory screen was a bit of a let down but so be it.

Quote from: LongBlade on July 09, 2012, 08:59:58 PM
Hmmm. Have been tempted to take the plunge on this but I'm not hearing people just raving about how great it is.

It is a fun game. It needs a bit of work but it interesting. The different factions do play differently. Yeah the AI needs a bit of work, the victory celebration could be a little more fun, but the rest of the game is very good.I actually like the card affected battle scenes. In a grand strategy game I'm not too worried that I can't directly control the battle. They are intersting to watch when the forces are large and evenly matched. Then your card choices can have a larger effect... especially whne you admirals gain some of the funky cards that cost money to use!

I've started my second serious game, this time as the Sophons. They are science oriented so I'll try and get the victory. Playing on normal difficulty, huge map with 33% more systems than normal, but with many constellations and few conections between constellations. This will reall hamper movement and exploration for the first 70 turns or so.

To me, this game is what I had hoped SotS I + expansions had been. But I found the RTS battles so frustrating and the colony development so bland that I gave up on the game.

@Joram - you can change the number of turn in the game, up or down, and I think you can turn that off completely.

The chatter here seems to have waned a bit.  Maybe the announcement of 3 free "add-ons"  (http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/09/endless-space-3-free-add-ons-before-the-expansion/) will liven things up some.

And an  expansion (http://forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?9637-Expansion-pack) coming as well...

Free add-on #1 (ETA: end of Sep 2012)

Features / Improvements:
- The Automatons Custom Faction
- Custom Faction Affinity, so you can differentiate the visual affinity [...]
- Diplomacy Improvement on alliances, to be aware of allies decisions
- Trade Routes Sum-up : special panel to summarize and sort trade routes
- AI : improved tax rate management
- Hero management improvement: navigation, selection, leveling and undo
- Empire Wide factors more readable in a special panel
- Multiplayer version consistency check

Balancing:
- Economic victory possible in Endless Victory (difficulty tuning)
- Academy, hero balancing, for more balanced game starts
- Bushido trait (Hissho) balancing
- Industry cost balancing for repair and tonnage modules

Modding:
- Ability to mod ship meshes and textures (that is a big one)

Looks more like a patch to me...

Quote from: steve58 on September 06, 2012, 03:31:59 PM

Looks more like a patch to me...

That's why its free...but still, some companies would definitely charge.

Quote from: steve58 on September 06, 2012, 03:31:59 PM


Looks more like a patch to me...

Yeah.

Although the addition of an extra faction could be considered something extra, I suppose, if it's a full faction and not just 1 extra bonus option in the Custom Faction choices.  Sounds kinda like the latter so not sure.

The first free add-on has been released...

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/10/endless-space-add-on-rise-of-the-automatons-on-steam/

Quote
According to the publisher the most important features of this free add-on #1 are:
•  Addition of the new Automatons custom faction
•  GUI changes such as a new Trade Route panel and updated Empire Management screen
•  Upgraded and updated diplomacy and alliance options
•  Improved hero management
•  Improved AI
•  Fixes, amendments and changes

Quote
Apparently, your current game saves will not be compatible with this new version to come out today. So, make sure to stop Steam's auto-update feature if you plan to finish your current game :)

Quote from: steve58 on October 03, 2012, 08:17:32 AM
The first free add-on has been released...

http://www.spacesector.com/blog/2012/10/endless-space-add-on-rise-of-the-automatons-on-steam/

Quote
According to the publisher the most important features of this free add-on #1 are:
•  Addition of the new Automatons custom faction
•  GUI changes such as a new Trade Route panel and updated Empire Management screen
•  Upgraded and updated diplomacy and alliance options
•  Improved hero management
•  Improved AI
•  Fixes, amendments and changes

Quote
Apparently, your current game saves will not be compatible with this new version to come out today. So, make sure to stop Steam's auto-update feature if you plan to finish your current game :)

OOooo!

Those added features look to be more beefy than what the earlier list mentioned.

And even more gaming news today!

QuoteICEBERG INTERACTIVE ANNOUNCES ENDLESS SPACE: DISHARMONY EXPANSION PACK COMING THIS SUMMER

New Faction, Weapon Systems, Fighters, and Bombers Add Infinite Dimensions to Endless Space

Haarlem, The Netherlands – May 28, 2013 — Videogame publisher Iceberg Interactive announced today Endless Space: Disharmony, the first full Expansion Pack for the popular 4X game Endless Space, will be coming to Steam this summer for $9.99. After four free DLC packs, Endless Space: Disharmony displays Amplitude Studios' ongoing commitment to enhancing the wildly successful 4X space strategy game Endless Space, since its critically-acclaimed release last summer.

Endless Space: Disharmony brings a brand new experience to Endless Space players by debuting a new faction called "The Harmony." Battles have never been so intense with the addition of fighters and bombers, battle formations, a new targeting system, a redesigned weapon system and enhanced invasion mechanics. The AI opponents will be significantly more unpredictable with the implementation of the new 'Adaptive Multi-Agenda Artificial Intelligence System.'

"We're lucky to have a motivated team and even luckier to have such an incredible community," commented Mathieu Girard, CEO of Amplitude Studios. "Our expansion pack has been designed based on player requests and community G2G votes, and we hope that it fulfills – or surpasses – their expectations."

Endless Space: Disharmony Game Features:

    A brand new Faction called "The Harmony" with the main objective to ANNIHILATE DUST!
    New fighters and bomber units that will completely change the shape of combat, especially with the new Battle Formation and Targeting systems
    A complete rework of the Ship Design Interface giving an improved Weapon System that includes family types for modules (short, medium and long range)
    New invasion mechanics have been added: prepare the population for bombardments, sieges and land invasions
    Expect to face a real challenge when playing against AI opponents with the new Adaptive Multi-Agent Artificial Intelligence System (AMAS)
    Other additions and features voted or requested by the community include:
    ​    Four new heroes (Games2Gether)
        A new option to disable exchange of technologies, as a request from the Multiplayer community
        New Rally Points feature for newly built ships to reduce micromanagement

Endless Space: Disharmony will be available both as DLC and as retail this summer for $9.99.

The price is nice, too.  :)  I hope we get this sooner rather than later in the summer.

while I know Im beating a dead horse here it just seems like somethings not quite right visually.

Quote from: GDS_Starfury on May 28, 2013, 08:28:24 PM
while I know Im beating a dead horse here it just seems like somethings not quite right visually.

How do you mean?

Looks like i am going to buy this next year when i install my new computer. I like the new features in the addon.

I'm in for this.  Geek and I have been playing some multiplayer and we're utterly absorbed, it's fantastic.  It's causing me to miss out on a great deal of sleep!

I believe the new "Disharmony" expansion just came out, methinks.  There was a big download for ES going when I just logged in.

FYI. CYA. FINGA.

Purchasing and downloading :)

Yeah, I have to buy this expansion. One thing I remember not liking about Endless Space is the fact there are no empire borders shown when you zoom out. In fact, there is very little information when you zoom out. Hopefully that's been changed in this update.

What's the verdict?  Strangely, right after the expansion went up on Steam, the game's website and forums crashed.  I haven't been able to get any news on it other than a few Facebook postings, one of which said there were a great many bugs.  I've been holding off buying it until I hear otherwise.

BTW:  Amplitude has a new G2G poll which asks:  "If Amplitude was to make another 4X strategy game, which aspect would you like to see more developed in that game?"

This seems to suggest to me that the development cycle for ES is now over.  That would be a big disappointment to me because I think there is still a lot that could be done with ES.

Odd, I have been on amplitudes forums several times this evening. There seems to be a few bugs but nothing earth shattering. People seem to like the fighters a lot.

I was just on and the forum seems fine, several posts over last few hours. Anyway, seems like the normal amount of bugs and such for a new DLC. There is not a lot of forum activity but then again, this was released with little fanfare and its not exactly a mainstream game anyway. I might give it a shot now

Yeah, I just checked the forums and it looks like they are back online.  Not a lot of posts, though, but again that could be due to this afternoon's outage. 

Well, if anyone gets it, let me know what you think.  I am curious.

Quote from: bbmike on June 26, 2013, 03:48:43 PM
Yeah, I have to buy this expansion. One thing I remember not liking about Endless Space is the fact there are no empire borders shown when you zoom out. In fact, there is very little information when you zoom out. Hopefully that's been changed in this update.

I recall there being a colored 'influence' zone around planets you control, for some time now.   :o

Did that come in a patch after release or something?  It's certainly not new.

Quote from: Nefaro on June 26, 2013, 10:44:20 PM

Quote from: bbmike on June 26, 2013, 03:48:43 PM
Yeah, I have to buy this expansion. One thing I remember not liking about Endless Space is the fact there are no empire borders shown when you zoom out. In fact, there is very little information when you zoom out. Hopefully that's been changed in this update.

I recall there being a colored 'influence' zone around planets you control, for some time now.   :o

Did that come in a patch after release or something?  It's certainly not new.

When you zoom in closer to the systems you do see a 'influence color' around your systems and their names. When you zoom all the way out all you see on the map are just stars and nothing else. No names, no color, no nothing. And it's still like that after this expansion. After my 1st hour with this expansion I'm really not seeing a lot of new changes. I'll give it some more time though.

Endless Space Emperor Edition is 66% off (10.19 USD) on Steam this weekend. ES EE+Disharmony is 17.49 USD. I'm still unsure on the card combat mechanic, but for that price I think I'm going to pull the trigger. Of course as soon as I do that the Steam summer sale is going to start and it will be on sale for 5$....

Quote from: Kushan on June 27, 2013, 10:53:51 PM
Of course as soon as I do that the Steam summer sale is going to start and it will be on sale for 5$....

That's what I'm waiting for...  ;D 

Wait no longer...

Gamestop has the new Endless Space Disharmony DLC on sale for $4.99 (http://www.impulsedriven.com/products/ESD-IMP-W4924).

p.s.  I was a bit ticked when I saw "This product is not yet available." in the email from Gamestop, but once I fired up the Gamestop app, I saw the Disharmony DLC in my game list and got the code which installed just fine...

The stumbling block I cannot forgive is combat. The card system is clunky, but I'll give it a pass. The problem is the visual combat representation. It is nothing but the same boring video repeated endlessly for every combat. Repetitive, boring and unrewarding. I have gone back to MOO3, patched, with occasional lapses into SoTS2 and Distant Worlds.

Quote from: solops on July 06, 2013, 09:18:26 AM
The stumbling block I cannot forgive is combat. The card system is clunky, but I'll give it a pass. The problem is the visual combat representation. It is nothing but the same boring video repeated endlessly for every combat. Repetitive, boring and unrewarding. I have gone back to MOO3, patched, with occasional lapses into SoTS2 and Distant Worlds.

I almost did it when it was one sale on Steam a few weekends ago but decided against it. The combat is what keeps me from pulling the trigger too. And for solo play, I don't know if I want  a "simpler" space 4x when I have Distant Worlds and a patched MOO3.

Funny thing is now, I kind of like the combat...I just find it a bit shallow in terms of managing the economy, spying, etc.

Well, Geek and I just finished an epic game of this against three AIs.  Embarrassingly we had to admit defeat at the end.  We'd managed to rip apart two of the AI empires, but the Automatons had become unstoppable in the meantime.  Their ships were bristling with firepower and they had so many defensive modules that our best ships couldn't even scratch them.  By the time we quit the game, Geek was within a few turns of losing something like 13 of his systems.  Incredible.  I need to do some research to see how it was even possible for the Automatons to become that powerful.

Despite the loss, though, we had a fantastic time!  Thanks in part to the best UI I've seen in a game, Endless Space is an utter joy to play.  Managing your empire is incredibly easy and all the information you need is always right where you need it, when you need it.  While initially put off by the controversial combat mechanics, I grew to enjoy it.  While Solops may have a point about the visual representation, you don't actually lose anything here: each battle has its own report screen afterwards, where you can see how effective your weapons and defensive modules were.  You don't even need to watch the combat, since you can choose your cards and then click auto.  The battle report will even tell you how each card played out.

Excellent game.  We're going to take a detour via Sins of a Solar Empire next but I can see plenty of Endless Space in the future. 8)

Huw the Poo....I'm into Distant Worlds: Shadows, playing solo against the AI.  But when I read a post like yours (well done, by the way!) I get the itch to check out the summer sales for Endless Space. 

Thanks Rayfer!  The only thing that might bother you is the way combat works, so I recommend checking out some vids to try and get a feel for it.  Personally I think the whole game is just sublime, easily one of the best 4X I've played in a long time.  And yeah, it's bound to be in a sale this summer so you should definitely pick it up. :)

I've reached the late stage of the game with the Sowers.... I roughly own more systems then they do and I 2 or 3 times the dust they do.  So far it has been grinding to take their systems one by one as they continue to offer a cease fire to no doubt regain their strength.  Not sure if I will press on as the end is inevitable, resistance is futile... they will be assimilated.


PE

For those interested in picking up Endless Space (http://store.steampowered.com/app/208140/), Steam has it on sale for the next couple of days. Get Endless Space - Emperor Edition for $7.49 or Endless Space Gold for $8.74 U.S.

New free Free Add-On -  The Search For Auriga was released today, along with the following release notes.

I'll have to try and get around to playing another game...... at some point.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

CHANGES AND ADDITIONS [Classic versions]
Modified Sheredyn Affinity: buyout bonus lowered from 50% to 33% (like in the Disharmony version)

CHANGES AND ADDITIONS [Both versions]
Wonder option added: Allows you to able / disable wonders
Capped buyoutbonus to -90% to avoid bugs when going over 100% buyout bonus
Default GameDifficulty and GameSpeed are now saved in Registry.xml

CHANGES AND ADDITIONS [Disharmony version]
Creation of a unique planet: AURIGA
New Wonder: Husk of knowledge
2 new Heroes
Added Rally Point (Keep Left CTRL to enter rally point mode: left click to select start system and left click to select destination's system)
Scrapping a ship gives you Dust
A repair button has been added
A Magnify button has been added, in some notification, it allows to focus the concerned system or fleet
New alert panel [in the negotiation screen] When an ally makes a diplomatic decision
Disable negotiations when an alliance request is waiting for its resolution
Wonders and unique planets are visible for the Amoeba players in the galaxy view
Entering or leaving an alliance refreshes the system influences
Improve the way defence stats are computed at the end of a battle
Unique planet Option added: Allows you to able / disable creation of unique planet in the galaxy
Add an option to keep the rally points always visible
Purified systems have a different background colour (grey) in the galaxy view
Improved contracts offering to avoid possible stability issues in MP
Added a reduction on damage for weapon which are not firing during their range speciality: -50% damage
Battle mood or faction mood are now displayed depending on the context
Divided damage done by bombers per 2
Increased long range accuracy and efficiency
Modified MP to reflect the used tonnage

AI MODIFICATIONS
When the AI send a war declaration, it must be followed immediately by a battle
Each time the AI made a diplomatic choice the player will be notified with a short explanation
AI invasion fleet must not come back to the assault if we crush his combat fleet
When the AI scouts are destroyed, the AI must not keep creating them again and again
Added variety in the AI attack targeting
The AI select the best formation & targeting; not anymore randomly one from 3
Lowered weight for Retreat and Offensive Retreat
Updated weight on formation & targeting for the AI to choose
Replaced one of the unique technologies of the Pilgrim which was not aesthetically positioned


HARMONY BALANCING
Rebalanced game difficulty progression for Harmony
Added a property HasTolerantTrait
Fixed a bug regarding tolerant trait and starting technology reported by the community
Lowered cost of Mineral Memory from 15 to 5
Disharmony now affects the planet only and not the system anymore: thus the player can more easily colonise planets with dust and earn some industry / resources from it. However, the science and food will decrease faster than before but only on the planet
Fixed an issue on several effects related to natural wonders
Added a new planetary infrastructure for Harmony which increases the local deposit of a strategic resource by 1
Modified PathPrerequisites for the new Strategic Resource Improvement in order to show it only when the player discovered the strategic resource
Removed penalty related to ownership for Harmony
Reduced cost of StarSystemImprovementUniqueHarmony from 500 to 300
Modified the tool tip of StarSystemImprovementDefense4Harmony, thus the bonus in Food and Science is added to the list of modifiers
Increase default repair rate
Improve damage and defence fleet depending of their total of command points to compensate the absence of heroes
Added a new planetary improvement for Harmony that gives +1 strategic resource deposit

FIXED
Fixed a desync due to locust points when joining a game.
Fixed a desync due to approval status when joining a game.
Fixed a desync due dust leech.
Fixed a desync due to the Sheredyn's battle stasis.
Fixed a desync due to affinity mapping after an encounter.
Fixed an issue on a diplomatic behaviour: reduces the probability of multiple wars
Fixed a bug regarding the Normal Difficulty reported on the forums
Fixed an issue where the trade routes incomes were displayed differently in the system screen and in the trade routes panel
Fixed an issue where typing a space character at the beginning of a "rename" text field caused an assert
Fixed an issue where the effects of infinite improvements did not refreshed the empire management screen
Fixed an issue where Growth were not properly loaded
Fixed an issue where Modules repair process property value was not saved
Fixed a bug reported by the community related to Tolerant
Fixed an issue on a diplomatic behaviour
Fixed an issue which allow the AI to transgress Waiting Period in case of war declaration
Fixed a bug regarding Normal Difficulty where Expansion Disapproval Difficulty was still 4x
Fixed issue on several effects related to natural wonders
Fixed: The resources needed for an advanced ship design are not marked as unavailable in the ship resource requirements tooltip
Fixed: The auto-upgrade button from the ship design menu does not fill up all the tonnage of the selected ship when clicked and weapons were not added
Fixed a bug on a AIPrerequisite for the Industry to Food Improvement
Fixed an issue about contract proposals
Fixed an assert about contracts
Fixed an issue where fleets could be modified by AI even when they were in a battle
Fixed an issue where the game remained stuck on end turn after the death of an empire
Fixed an issue where wonders could be put on Asteroids
Fixed an issue where a wonder and an anomaly could be present at the same time on a planet
Fixed an issue where fleets from different players could overlap when orbiting the same system
Fixed an issue where wonders were not put on uninhabited region first
Terraformation and anomaly reduction are now saved for razed systems
Fixed an issue where many fleet sorting options did not work in the military screen
Fixed an issue where the empire approval value was not properly refreshed after moving the tax rate slider
forums.amplitude-studios.com/showthread.php?19341-2-bugs-relating-to-the-Tolerant-trait-(Disharmony-1.1.17)

--------------------------------------------------------------------

PE

wow - might have to rustle up some Huw and se if he wants another go at the AI